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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

United Kingdom
1253 Posts

Posted - 07/14/2016 :  19:35:21   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
No, I accused you guys of ageism.

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 07/14/2016 :  21:08:40   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

No, I accused you guys of ageism.
I never suggested that Dawkins said what he said because he's old. There are plenty of young atheists who are assholes, too.

I'm still interested in your "regressive left" bit.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

United Kingdom
1253 Posts

Posted - 07/14/2016 :  21:40:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by On fire for Christ

No, I accused you guys of ageism.
I never suggested that Dawkins said what he said because he's old. There are plenty of young atheists who are assholes, too.


You didn't come out and say it. That much is true.

I'm still interested in your "regressive left" bit.


Think about it a bit longer. It'll be more satisfying if you get there without my help.

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 07/14/2016 :  22:03:06   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

You didn't come out and say it. That much is true.
Never said it, implied it, or even thought it.
I'm still interested in your "regressive left" bit.
Think about it a bit longer. It'll be more satisfying if you get there without my help.
Go somewhere else to play games, please.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 07/20/2016 :  10:22:14   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks to today's Jesus and Mo, I was led to Wikipedia, which led me to The Rise Of The #Regressiveleft Hashtag, which includes Sam Harris' definition:
Pseudo-liberals who are so blinded by identity politics that they reliably take the side of a backward mob over one of its victims. Rather than protect individual women, apostates, intellectuals, cartoonists, novelists, and true liberals from the intolerance of religious imbeciles, they protect these [Muslim] theocrats from criticism.
I don't know of anyone who fits that definition. And given its expansion into a term that has...
...become a catchall for any element of the dominant new media culture that the anti-SJW internet doesn’t like...
...I don't think I'm missing much.

I read a bunch of the comments, too. Lot of people decrying the "regressive left" without even a single example of one, except from a person who seems to think that anyone who disagrees with him is obviously a member of the "regressive left."

But you, OFfC, must feel very strange aligning yourself with capital-A Atheists (and major asshats) like Dawkins, Harris and Maher by using a term that they popularized.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

United Kingdom
1253 Posts

Posted - 07/20/2016 :  23:29:10   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
was it satisfying though? To find out about it yourself?

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 07/21/2016 :  09:19:54   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

was it satisfying though? To find out about it yourself?
Satisfying? To learn (by accident) that you were perpetuating another myth?

No. Should it have been? What did I do wrong?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Christian Hedonist
Skeptic Friend

99 Posts

Posted - 03/10/2017 :  15:41:43   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Christian Hedonist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by darwinalogos2

Dave, the belief's of "many Protestants today" , which according to you seem to include that Jesus didn't need to exist to save us are irrelevant.
All I can go on is what Christians tell me they believe, because they can all point to the same Bible verses and tell me they mean different things.
Why do you treat the bible differently than other books? When a Christian tells you a passage means something but the context and actual words say something different, then just tell them so. Christians read into the text a lot more than they read out of the text. You wouldn't allow that from other books would you?

For example many Christians believe that the story of David and Goliath is about them. That God will be there to slay their goliaths or problems in their lives. Nowhere in the text does it say this. Most confusion can be cleared up by reading in context what a passage actually says.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 03/10/2017 :  23:23:51   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Why do you treat the bible differently than other books?
I don't. If people treated The Hunt for Red October like they treated the Bible, I'd be talking about percentages there, too.

When a Christian tells you a passage means something but the context and actual words say something different, then just tell them so.
Yeah, that'll change someone's mind.

Look, the idea that some passages in the Bible mean one thing to some people while to others it means something different is as old as the Bible. The Franciscans disagreed with the Holy Roman See as to whether Jesus owned anything. The Protestants still disagree with the Catholics over whether God's Word needs to be transmitted through priests. There's a reason that there are over 1,500 distinct Christian sects within the U.S. alone.

Here's one of my favorite religious jokes:
Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump.

I said, "Don't do it!"

He said, "Nobody loves me."

I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"

He said, "Yes."

I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?"

He said, "A Christian."

I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?"

He said, "Protestant."

I said, "Me, too! What franchise?"

He said, "Baptist."

I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?"

He said, "Northern Baptist."

I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"

He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist."

I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?"

He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region."

I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?"

He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912."

I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.


- Emo Philips

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Christian Hedonist
Skeptic Friend

99 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2017 :  14:15:34   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Christian Hedonist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Why do you treat the bible differently than other books?
I don't. If people treated The Hunt for Red October like they treated the Bible, I'd be talking about percentages there, too.
Then why do you say you cannot determine what the bible says? Read it for yourself just like any other book.



Look, the idea that some passages in the Bible mean one thing to some people while to others it means something different is as old as the Bible. The Franciscans disagreed with the Holy Roman See as to whether Jesus owned anything. The Protestants still disagree with the Catholics over whether God's Word needs to be transmitted through priests. There's a reason that there are over 1,500 distinct Christian sects within the U.S. alone.
My question is why can't you determine by reading the bible if they are right or wrong?

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25903 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2017 :  17:45:21   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Then why do you say you cannot determine what the bible says? Read it for yourself just like any other book.
Back in the day, there were people who took Robert Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land or Samuel Delaney's Dhalgren at more than face value, and tried to start social movements based on them. The rest of us science fiction fans called those people "kooks."

If I read the Bible "like any other book," it'd be as an obvious work of historical fiction, and anyone who actually believed in the magic stuff and afterlife fantasies in the Bible would also be a "kook." So the question of which kook is reading the Bible more "correctly" than which other kook is simply absurd.

To put it another way, any argument about why I should care what the Bible says begins with an (often unstated) incorrect premise. And any argument that begins with an incorrect premise cannot be sound.

However, that people believe things about the stories in the Bible is a simple fact. It's also a fact that people act on those beliefs. It's also a fact that many people with one belief about the stories in the Bible disagree with many other people about what those same stories mean. If it's something they want me to agree with, they'll have to tell me why they're right and the others are wrong, because I think all their arguments are necessarily unsound.

In still other words, I don't have a dog in the race over how many angels can dance on the head of a pin (for example). It's up to the people who think that's an important question to make their own arguments about it, and convince me that the people who disagree are wrong.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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