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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
 Posted - 07/27/2001 : 10:42:57 [Permalink]
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quote:
Don't forget that you live in LA. A lot of good, hard working people starve to death every year. They are not lazy drug addicts.
I'm very interested in seeing a source for the information on people starving to death in the U.S. Can you provide a link?
I'm curious as to why people (if there really are any) starve to death in the U.S. when food is so readily available from soup kitchens, churches, and even the trash, as sad and degrading as that is.
[I've heard of children "going hungry", but I've not heard of people actually starving to death. Not saying it doesn't happen, just wanting some hard facts to back it up.]
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Ma gavte la nata!
Edited by - tokyodreamer on 07/27/2001 10:44:31 |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2001 : 10:48:53 [Permalink]
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quote:
I'm very interested in seeing a source for the information on people starving to death in the U.S. Can you provide a link?
I wasn't referring to the US here.
@tomic
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law! |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2001 : 11:23:52 [Permalink]
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quote:
I wasn't referring to the US here.
Whoops! My bad! I thought you were saying hard working people were starving to death every day in L.A.! D'oh! 
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2001 : 22:03:23 [Permalink]
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Bestonnet: The US is a *Democratic Republic* not a *true* Democracy.
He's YOUR god, they're YOUR rules, YOU burn in hell! |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2001 : 22:11:54 [Permalink]
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quote:
Whoops! My bad! I thought you were saying hard working people were starving to death every day in L.A.! D'oh!
As long as models and other bulemics are not counted.
@tomic
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law! |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2001 : 02:09:03 [Permalink]
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quote:
While it sounds like a cool thing(world government)
It's not a good idea, that's something out of the movies. An Utopia, Shangrala. Why should everyone be under one law. Perhaps the same 'checks and balances' in the gov. of the USA are needed in a larger scope as in different governments of the world to not let anyone become more powerful.
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And Snake this is not just an education issue. Even if it was solved by education alone what would everyone eat until they were educated?? Huge numbers of people have starved, recently, because of warfare. There is a lack of good irrigation or even just clean water. There are poor tools and natural disasters which can render millions homeless.
Natures way of thining the population.
quote:
Don't forget that you live in LA. A lot of good, hard working people starve to death every year. They are not lazy drug addicts.
@tomic
LOL, oh I can't forget that. LA sucks, you can't avoid it. However, anyone who works hard and starves, is stupid, I guess. Yes, there are probably a few who 'fall through the cracks', but I don't believe it's the huge numbers you are making it sound like. Hey, those 'Viet Nam vets' who beg on the streets are not skin and bones.
VHEMT |
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bestonnet_00
Skeptic Friend
Australia
358 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2001 : 04:04:15 [Permalink]
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The US isn't only a psuedo-democracy where who gets in power is decided by who uses the most dirty tricks and vote nullification when it suits them.
As for world government, it would pretty much get rid of war provided it is well thought out and more democratic then the UN or US (which was originally a confederation about as powerful as the UN).
It wouldn't be perfect, but it would be better then what we have now.
Radioactive GM Crops.
Slightly above background.
Safe to eat.
But no activist would dare rip it out.
As they think it gives them cancer. |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2001 : 17:39:46 [Permalink]
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quote:
The US isn't only a psuedo-democracy where who gets in power is decided by who uses the most dirty tricks and vote nullification when it suits them.
What do you mean by this? This sentence is fragmentary and does not contain a complete thought. Something is missing and I'd really like it clarified.
He's YOUR god, they're YOUR rules, YOU burn in hell! |
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Espritch
Skeptic Friend
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2001 : 19:58:59 [Permalink]
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This goes a ways back in this thread but I feel that some clarification is required.
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You should read Albert Camus' "The Stranger".
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I did a book report about it many many years ago in a philosophy class. While I DO live 'in the moment' in many areas of my life, I'm not without the reason, to think about the consequences of my actions, should I feel like killing someone. In other words I don't want to experience being in jail, in fact I already have, so no thank you. Been there, done that.
I only mentioned this book because the anti-hero used the heat as his explanation of why he shot someone. I wasn't actually advocating this sort of thing. I personally think that people should be held accountable for their own actions regardless of the weather.
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If you've ever been to a country were it really IS hot, as I have and see how people cope you'd know as I do that Americans are sissys.
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Of course we're sissies. We can afford to be. If the people in some of those hot countries could afford AC, I bet they would be just as sissyfied as we are.
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Well, I have nothing to say to that! You sound just like those xians who think animals and everything else on this planet was put here JUST for the benifit of Man.
Many people in those countries can afford A/C, btw.
Hmmm. Maybe a I was being a little too subtle. I thought that the smiley face would be sufficient to indicate that I didn't actually mean for this to be taken seriously. I actually consider myself an environmentalist and I think that it is one of the great tragedies of our times that we as a species seem so hell bent on destroying everything else on the planet. I can think of few philosophies as far removed from my own as those of xians and republicans who think the only measure of the value of an old growth forest is the number of board feet of lumber you can get out of it. Luckily, I have fairly thick skin or I might have been somewhat offended by your presumption.
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I do not think it's wrong for people to be armed and all the debates over registration are stupid. 2nd amendment, yes! Freedom to bear arms, yes. It's just a very few who abuse that right and give the others a bad name.
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In this case, it only takes a very few.
It only takes a few auto accidents, a few people triping in the bathtub, falling down stairs, and on and on. We don't live in a perfect world. Should we take away cars, people should only take showers, build one story buildings? Things happen everyday. But I'd like to believe there are more responsible people then not. In fact if there weren't we'd all be dead from gun shots now. Or hit and run cars.
Maybe you should employ emoticons so I'll know when you are joking. Surely you don't mean to imply that someone tripping in a bath tub is equivalent to someone shooting someone?
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Espritch
Skeptic Friend
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 07/28/2001 : 20:04:01 [Permalink]
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Personally, I don't have a problem with responsible people owning guns. I grew up around guns and know plenty of decent people who own them. The problem is the ease with which any psychotic can get one in this country (I mean the USA - lest Bestonnet accuse me of claiming the US is the center of the universe). Every time there is a report in the paper about some nut case armed to the teeth shooting a bunch of people there is inevitably a letter to the editor explaining how the problem could easily have been averted if there had just been someone NRA gun owner there to shoot the perpetrator. Somehow I just don't buy the argument that the solution to gun violence is more guns.
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2001 : 11:17:59 [Permalink]
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quote:
Surely you don't mean to imply that someone tripping in a bath tub is equivalent to someone shooting someone?
The point in this idea is in response to the (nonsensical) statistics that claim anywhere from 10 to 14 "kids" are killed everyday in the U.S. from guns, so we must "take them away".
More (real) kids are killed by more mundane things everyday, but no one calls for them to be outlawed. The crux of the problem is the argument of need. I say the need for the availability of guns to protect our rights outweighs the dangers of the guns themselves.
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Bathtub related deaths during a three year study period exceeded those due to handgun accidents, all forms of road vehicles accidents, ladder and scaffolding falls.
http://www.slipgrip.com/facts.htm
By golly, those evil bathtub manufactures are too greedy to develope "Smart" tubs! Let's get the government in on this! 
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Ma gavte la nata! |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2001 : 11:28:15 [Permalink]
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It is absurd to compare slipping in a bathtub to shooting someone. I don't care if the number of injuries from slipping are 100,000 times higher than deaths or injuries from shooting. The issue is that one can be regulated and should be because the devices are extremely dangerous! They are manufactured as devices intended to kill someone. A bathtub is simply not the same thing.
@tomic
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law! |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2001 : 15:38:26 [Permalink]
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It's quite interesting being non-american and listening to this gun debate. I grew up in Sweden where guns are very tightly controlled. The only people who own guns are hunters, police, army-people and the odd criminal (of course). The point is that not very many people have guns (it was even outlawed to carry a knife in a public place a few years ago). Do you feel safe growing up in that kind of society? You bet. You might not be able to defend yourself to the same extent that you people do, but then there is generally no need to either.
Up, up and away!!! |
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Greg
Skeptic Friend
USA
281 Posts |
Posted - 07/29/2001 : 18:51:34 [Permalink]
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quote:
I say the need for the availability of guns to protect our rights outweighs the dangers of the guns themselves.
What rights do we have that require firearms to protect? Usually, rights are protected by the rule of law and something called a constitution. While it's true that the right to bear arms is in the constitution of the US, that does not mean that the number and type of firearms in circulation cannot and should not be controlled. In the US, we have the right to free speech. I'll bet though if you try to publicly threaten the President with death or incite a riot, you will be arrested.
Greg.
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