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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
 Posted - 06/01/2005 : 07:27:03
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Ham blabs in the latest AiG how creationists should engage in debate. In particular, he warns against debating non-Christians about creation/evolution without stipulating that the Bible is a valid piece of evidence. *Yawn*
But more frustrating is the final section, when he presents two conversations he claims to have had with atheists:
quote:
A young man approached me at a seminar and stated, ‘Well, I still believe in the big bang, and that we arrived here by chance random processes. I don't believe in God.' I answered him, ‘Well, then obviously your brain, and your thought processes, are also the product of randomness. So you don't know whether it evolved the right way, or even what right would mean in that context. Young man, you don't know if you're making correct statements or even whether you're asking me the right questions.'
The young man looked at me and blurted out, ‘What was that book you recommended?' He finally realized that his belief undercut its own foundations —such ‘reasoning' destroys the very basis for reason.
On another occasion, a man came to me after a seminar and said, ‘Actually, I'm an atheist. Because I don't believe in God, I don't believe in absolutes, so I recognize that I can't even be sure of reality.' I responded, ‘Then how do you know you're really here making this statement?' ‘Good point,' he replied. ‘What point?' I asked. The man looked at me, smiled, and said, ‘Maybe I should go home.' I stated, ‘Maybe it won't be there.' ‘Good point,' the man said. ‘What point?' I replied.
This man certainly got the message. If there is no God, ultimately, philosophically, how can one talk about reality? How can one even rationally believe that there is such a thing as truth, let alone decide what it is?
First off, I'm fairly certain that Ham just made these up. If not, then we can be sure that the "atheists" with whom he had these exchanges were the dumbest atheists ever as Ham's arguments are so flawed that it's frustrating to even read. Arrrghhh!
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bloody_peasant
Skeptic Friend
USA
139 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2005 : 09:22:26 [Permalink]
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| Yep apologists and many other Christian authors love to invent nameless atheists that they destroy with some weird illogical argument. I guess they get tired of getting destroyed in real life by real atheist that they have to invent fictinoal ones to release their pent up frustration. |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2005 : 12:56:36 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bloody_peasant
Yep apologists and many other Christian authors love to invent nameless atheists that they destroy with some weird illogical argument.
Indeed. I've often thought that these little "stupid atheist bested by the wit of a good christian" parables deserve to be considered their own literary genre. They are a prevalent, formulaic form of fiction that one can find inserted into their local church homilies or the odd email.
Also vying for genre status is the "unpatriotic person shamed by loud pro-troop proclamation that draws applause from nearby citizens" series of short stories.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
| Edited by - H. Humbert on 06/01/2005 13:11:09 |
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Maverick
Skeptic Friend
Sweden
385 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2005 : 06:19:52 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by an almost certainly imaginary atheist
‘Well, I still believe in the big bang, and that we arrived here by chance random processes. I don't believe in God.'
Funny how this atheist used exactly the words a creationist would: "chance random process". Urgh. I suppose creationists can't defeat any other kind of atheist than the strawman kind. I wonder why that is, and what that tells us. |
"Life is but a momentary glimpse of the wonder of this astonishing universe, and it is sad to see so many dreaming it away on spiritual fantasy." -- Carl Sagan |
| Edited by - Maverick on 06/02/2005 06:22:34 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2005 : 06:38:09 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Maverick
quote:
Originally posted by an almost certainly imaginary atheist
‘Well, I still believe in the big bang, and that we arrived here by chance random processes. I don't believe in God.'
Funny how this atheist used exactly the words a creationist would: "chance random process". Urgh. I suppose creationists can't defeat any other kind of atheist than the strawman kind. I wonder why that is, and what that tells us.
Too true.
It is actually a system perfected by our old friend and class clown, Kent Hovind. He tells the story of a having a conversation with some professor or other on an airplane. Of course, he devastated the prof with Bibical logic(?) and facts(?). Perhaps he was smoking hop at the time, and the ignorant professor was a dream from the long, brass pipe. I suspect that he shares that pipe with Jack Chick. Both spin pretty good yarns.
It is amusing to note that Ham has critizied Hovind numerous times for his weird claims, but doesn't hesitate to emulate them.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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bloody_peasant
Skeptic Friend
USA
139 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2005 : 07:51:47 [Permalink]
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| I wonder if they have read a Chick tract and basically incorporated the fictional tract into their real life as a false memory >:-D They've lied so much about it that it must be true :> |
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2005 : 09:28:22 [Permalink]
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| "It's not a lie if you believe it." - George Costanza |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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