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 Fascism on the march....
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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  03:41:59  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Anyone who hasn’t heard of super-douche Scott Walker, current governor of Wisconsin (what were they thinking? ), must be living in a Peruvian monastery. Or Texas. He’s become infamous for union busting, and now proposes to take over virtually all of the state’s finances. This would allow him to replace popularly elected officials (with whom, you ask? Take a guess) as well as his own brand of bean-counting.

Fascism is birthed in fear and confusion, and WI currently has plenty of those.
Scott Walker planning financial martial law in Wisconsin
by Chris in Paris on 4/17/2011 11:31:00 PM
#65532;
Enough is never enough with these extremists. Now Walker is reportedly planning to extend his overreach even more in Wisconsin. If nothing else, it should continue to help motivate Democrats to organize recall votes against the Republican agenda. Forbes:

Following the lead of Michigan GOP Governor Rick Snyder, Walker is said to be preparing a plan that would allow him to force local governments to submit to a financial stress test with an eye towards permitting the governor to take over municipalities that fail to meet with Walker’s approval.

According to the reports, should a locality’s financial position come up short, the Walker legislation would empower the governor to insert a financial manager of his choosing into local government with the ability to cancel union contracts, push aside duly elected local government officials and school board members and take control of Wisconsin cities and towns whenever he sees fit to do so.

Evidently, this is still in the “wet dream” stage of planning but it starts to remind of certain events that took place in Europe back in the 1930s.

I think the SPLC should define the Republican Party as a hate group. They sure do a lot of that.





"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  06:07:08   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Filthy,
I have had conflicting thoughts about Walker since the whole union busting debacle that has been happening here over the last couple of months. I used to hate him. I just couldn't even stand the look in his eyes. I did not vote for him.
Lately though I have been seeing him from a different perspective. When I compare what he is trying to accomplish to what the company I work for has gone throught the last few years I can see what he is trying to do.
Things have changed around here (at work) drasticly over the last few years. I notice that during the good times (the 90's - tlll a few years ago) the company spent a lot of time and money blowing smoke up our asses and making us feel good about ourselves. We contantly had motivational speakers come in. The company made up stupid little games that we we would play to make us feel all warm and fuzzy inside. All of these things made me cringe because I cannot stand being patronized.
When things got bad a 180 occurred. People who wouldn't pull their weight were shown the door. Our motivation became keeping our jobs. This caused the company to be run more efficiently (and me personally to work harder and find ways of being more efficient). I think our current motivation is much more effective than all of the feel-good bullshit we went through for years. We are now reaping the rewards of about three years worth of struggle and re-organizing.
I am beginning to see that this is what Walker is trying to accomplish. Yeah, it sucks. It's tough on those who are innefficient and don't work as hard as others but it needs to be done.

I still don't quite trust Walker though.

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26000 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  07:15:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
While efficiency is good, a bussiness' motive is profit, and a government's shouldn't be.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  07:24:42   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

While efficiency is good, a bussiness' motive is profit, and a government's shouldn't be.


Although the motivations are different the steps needed to be taken to attain efficiency are similar.

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26000 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  08:54:02   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Ebone4rock

Although the motivations are different the steps needed to be taken to attain efficiency are similar.
I'm not sure about that, either. When an organization's goals and total finances can change at the whim of 536 people, it seems that the long-term planning that's a first step towards efficiency goes out the window. And what motivation could (for example) a Medicare services employee have to work better or faster when his job is now suddenly on the political chopping block?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

Saudi Arabia
1265 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  08:56:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In my experience the carrot works better than the stick.

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Fripp
SFN Regular

USA
727 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  08:58:09   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Fripp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A couple of quick thoughts:

1) I am a state employee (there's no such thing as a state worker ) and I am in a union, but 99% of the time, I hate the coddling the union allows for piece-of-shit employees who would have been long ago fired in any other place. But, Scott Walker had absolutely NO interest in "efficiency" and budget cutting when he got rid of the collective bargaining rights. He wants to kill unions, PERIOD.

2) I've worked in both public and private sectors and it is a FACT that private business is no more efficient than the public sector. For every story of government worker waste, there's one for the private sector. Don't bother supplying some outrageous anecdote of some extreme story because they are no more indicative of the workforce in general than any private sector story I could come up with. Scott Adams of Dilbert fame has made a career out of these stories.

3) "Efficiency" is a code word for making one person do the work of two or three people in a workday of 12 or more hours without the commensurate increase in pay.

"What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon?"

"Oh, I'm sorry. I thought my Dark Lord of the Sith could protect a small thermal exhaust port that's only 2-meters wide! That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! You have any idea what this is going to do to my credit?!?!"

"What? Oh, oh, 'just rebuild it'? Oh, real [bleep]ing original. And who's gonna give me a loan, jackhole? You? You got an ATM on that torso LiteBrite?"
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13462 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  09:01:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ebone4rock:
I still don't quite trust Walker though.

Nor should you.

Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker admits that his union busting will not save the state any money

Wisconsin Gov Lying About Budget Crisis

Bottom line is this is nothing but a redistribution of wealth by Walker and the Koch brothers, whom he works for. Now he wants to suspend democratically elected local governments if they do not please him? I'm sorry. But that's the job of the people, not Walker. He has shown by his actions which includes defying a court ordered stay in order to determine what he and his Republican legislators have done is even legal, that he is not really interested in laws that he doesn't agree with or are inconvenient to his goals. As is the case with Rick Snyder of Michigan, Walker wants to be a dictator, not a governor.

This fight is an ideological attack on the middle class and the poor to serve corporate interests. It has very little to do with bringing more efficiency to government and has a whole lot to do with creating a plutocracy and eliminating the ability of the people to fight back. Just to make that point clear, the unions, as entities, are all that's left that can raise enough money to compete with the dollars that corporations use for funding candidates. The elimination of public works unions eliminates the competition. And given that Walkers union busting, by his own admission, will not save the state any money, you just must look at why it's so important to him.

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  09:19:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Fripp
3) "Efficiency" is a code word for making one person do the work of two or three people in a workday of 12 or more hours without the commensurate increase in pay.


Yes it is. Over the last few years I had to perform my own duties plus the duties of another 1 1/2 people. I went from working 42 hours per week Monday through Friday to working 48-50 hours and quite a few Saturdays also just to keep up. Pay stayed the same. I am willing to do it.

It's a whole hell of a lot better than being unemployed.

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13462 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  09:41:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Ebone4rock

Originally posted by Fripp
3) "Efficiency" is a code word for making one person do the work of two or three people in a workday of 12 or more hours without the commensurate increase in pay.


Yes it is. Over the last few years I had to perform my own duties plus the duties of another 1 1/2 people. I went from working 42 hours per week Monday through Friday to working 48-50 hours and quite a few Saturdays also just to keep up. Pay stayed the same. I am willing to do it.

It's a whole hell of a lot better than being unemployed.
What the company you work for does, and what you are willing to do to keep your job says nothing about governor Walkers intentions. It's clear that some companies have had to cut back to stay afloat in this bad economy. It follows. But how would you feel if someone you voted for was thrown out of office by the governor, even if you thought s/he was doing a good job? Or even a bad job? Isn't that your responsibility? Or are we going to throw democracy under the bus for what you call "efficiency?" Why not just vote for governor, and let him appoint everyone else to run your state? Because if you boil it down, that's what he's pushing for. Sure would make the voting process more streamlined, eh? So much less messy. Just hand whatever power you have over to the governor. Would that really work for you?


Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  10:02:43   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Kil

Originally posted by Ebone4rock

Originally posted by Fripp
3) "Efficiency" is a code word for making one person do the work of two or three people in a workday of 12 or more hours without the commensurate increase in pay.


Yes it is. Over the last few years I had to perform my own duties plus the duties of another 1 1/2 people. I went from working 42 hours per week Monday through Friday to working 48-50 hours and quite a few Saturdays also just to keep up. Pay stayed the same. I am willing to do it.

It's a whole hell of a lot better than being unemployed.
What the company you work for does, and what you are willing to do to keep your job says nothing about governor Walkers intentions. It's clear that some companies have had to cut back to stay afloat in this bad economy. It follows. But how would you feel if someone you voted for was thrown out of office by the governor, even if you thought s/he was doing a good job? Or even a bad job? Isn't that your responsibility? Or are we going to throw democracy under the bus for what you call "efficiency?" Why not just vote for governor, and let him appoint everyone else to run your state? Because if you boil it down, that's what he's pushing for. Sure would make the voting process more streamlined, eh? So much less messy. Just hand whatever power you have over to the governor. Would that really work for you?




And this is where my conflicting thoughts come from. Of course the governer should not have carte blanche but I do understand what needs to be done. It takes a whole lot of machismo to do it. Walker has it. I just wish we had someone who's integrity could be trusted more to do it.

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13462 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  10:35:26   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ebone4rock:
Of course the governer should not have carte blanche but I do understand what needs to be done. It takes a whole lot of machismo to do it. Walker has it. I just wish we had someone who's integrity could be trusted more to do it.
To do what? As far as I can tell, Walker is trying to balance the books that HE threw out of whack in order to shift more of the burdon to the middle class and the poor. He created a shortfall in order to justify an ideological position that is completely tilted toward the creation of a corporate state. This idea that he is for fiscal responsibility is just smoke he's blowing up your ass. It's a bait and switch. Guys like Walker and Ryan and the Koch brothers funded tea partier lackeys have kicked off a class war. Again, he has admitted that his union busting will not save the state one thin dime. But it will save the Koch brothers from having to deal with pesky things like paying fair wages or even having competition in funding candidates. This isn't about efficiency in government. It's about taking over the future control of government. They are gaming the system!

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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The Rat
SFN Regular

Canada
1342 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  16:00:15   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit The Rat's Homepage Send The Rat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Ebone4rockIt's a whole hell of a lot better than being unemployed.


And eating french-fried dogshit is preferable to starving. There's nothing wrong with being pissed off about your working conditions and trying to improve them. Saying that it's better than being unemployed really says nothing.

Bailey's second law; There is no relationship between the three virtues of intelligence, education, and wisdom.

You fiend! Never have I encountered such corrupt and foul-minded perversity! Have you ever considered a career in the Church? - The Bishop of Bath and Wells, Blackadder II

Baculum's page: http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=3947338590
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Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  17:23:13   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm with The Rat on this one.

Ebone, just because your employer is demanding more of you doesn't mean it is necessarily a good thing. In fact, if they are getting more hours out of you and not paying you for them, then they are violating federal law. A disgruntled employee is going to sue them (and win), then when the company is paying you all your back pay, punitive damages, lawyer fees, and court costs... how will that look for the bottom line? Will efficiency have improved?

If your company thinks pushing people for more increases productivity then they have forgotten history. Henry Ford demonstrated clearly, about 90 years ago, that productivity is maximized at a 40 hour work week. Overall productivity actually declines when you go to 45 or 50 hours. Obviously there are exceptions by individuals, but the trend is there. Companies that think they are getting more out of most of their people by demanding 50+ hour weeks are being mismanaged.

Henry Ford interview.

"Crunch Mode" = fail.

Productivity explained, references at the end, well worth your time to read.

It's a really really really bad idea for companies to try and demand more hours out of their people. Your company is going to end up doing poorly if the thing they have you doing (extra hours, no compensation) is widespread. It actually decreases productivity as opposed to increasing it, and is a losing management strategy.

So your gov is actually an anti-capitalist douchebag. You do not maximize efficiency by demanding more for less. That is some straight up communism there, its just been branded as "conservative" by people who want to game the system for short term profit.

You Wisconsonites need to recall your gov, recall all the gop douchebags who discarded your state legislature rules to get their way, and elect people who actually represent you instead of people who just want to suck the last drop of blood out of your corpses.

Get going on that ASAP.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
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sailingsoul
SFN Addict

2830 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  17:25:42   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sailingsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

In my experience the carrot works better than the stick.

The God in the Bible seems to disagree. SS

There are only two types of religious people, the deceivers and the deceived. SS
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

Saudi Arabia
1265 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2011 :  21:50:31   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Heaven and Hell are the ultimate carrot and stick.

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