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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 05/06/2011 :  07:41:47  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Do you want to spread the story of Genesis around, casting the Wqrd of God right into the teeth of the godless, scum-sucking evolutionists? Would you like to be able to disguise the dues ex machina of “Goddoneit” in such a way that it sounds all science-y & everything? Do you yearn to crush the foul Darwinists with their from-nothing religion in every way, from debate to casual conversation, to pillow talk -- perhaps even sneak it into the science class?

Of course you do! But unfortunately, you don’t know how and end up getting your plough cleaned every time you try. It’s discouraging,I know, but despair not; help is at hand! The Institute for Creation Research now provides a course that will show you how to do it. And you'll even get a diploma!
ICR Launches Online Apologetics Degree


For more than 40 years, the Institute for Creation Research has been the leader in scientific research, education, and media from a biblical creation point of view. Holding Scripture as sacred and authoritative—even on matters of science—ICR remains steadfast in our commitment to the accuracy and authenticity of the Genesis record.

Teachers in ministry today, both in the Church and in K-12 schools, need solid, biblically-based information to help them communicate truth with confidence. And that’s why ICR established the School of Biblical Apologetics—to train men and women in real-world apologetics.

And from a link in the announcement:
The ICR School of Biblical Apologetics seeks to provide quality educational programs for all students at a reasonable cost. As a private, religious, not-for-profit institution, the ICR and SOBA receive no support from taxes or other public funds, thus the tuition and fees charged must be supplemented by significant outside gifts from concerned individuals in order to keep costs at levels that are feasible for students. The expenses of students at SOBA are shown below. SOBA reserves the right to change all student charges, modify its services, or change its programs of study should economic conditions, political persecution, personnel limitations, curriculum revisions, and/or national emergency make it needed to do so.


Over all, this course, from buying the books to getting your sheepskin will run you a mere $14k or so, and cheap at twice the price.

So sign up, dear creationists, study hard and proudly accept your diploma, then come and talk to us.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/22/2011 :  15:15:40   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You can get there from here

There are about 1 billion Christians and about 1.5 billion Muslims out of a possible 6 billion world population. If you take India's population of 1 billion Hindus. One can safely say about 50% of the world population believe in the existence of God in one form or another and religion is still very much alive.

Scientist have gone as far as to publish in a well respected scientific journal strong evidence that ESP(Extrasensory Perception) exist. So modern scientist are moving in the arena of psychic phenomena or psi phenomena (the ability to see into the future).

Imagine when science and religion merge and with the aid of evolutionist/genealogist some are able to look into the past and trace their ancestor apes and just as easily with the aid of psychics look into the future and meet their Creator/God

http://unitedcats.wordpress.com/2010/10/21/scientists-prove-that-humans-can-see-into-the-future/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9677 Posts

Posted - 09/22/2011 :  19:43:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message  Reply with Quote
We have discussed that ESP-report, and so have other skeptics on several blogs. Many issues have been raised around the methodology, enough to cast serious doubt about the conclusion of ESP.

Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  07:02:43   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It is hardly surprising to hear we have skeptics on this forum. To doubt that science can provide the bridge that can not only convince us to accept the indelible stamp of our lowly ancestors but also connect us to our creator through paranormal experiences like ESP/PSI which is regarded as rare human talents.

ESP is a natural consequence of our interconnected, entangled physical reality. These are new frontiers for science and just like early Pavlov experiments have demonstrated most of us are driven by early conditioning and quite incapable of the type of critical thinking need to make that quantum leap.

SETI search for extraterrestrial intelligence an ambitious attempt to search for intelligent extraterrestrial life using rudimentary radio wave/frequencies opened the debate to better and more advanced means of communication. If we want to connect and communicate with more intelligent beings we have to develop more intelligent communication systems to succeed.

The same mind power that can explore the origins of the Big Bang from the confines of a wheel chair eg. (Stephen Hawking) can certainly uncover the origin of the universe and someday ask the intelligent designer the intelligent question. Why? Which might look something like this ".-- .... -.-- ..--.. "
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  07:18:08   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime

ESP is a natural consequence of our interconnected, entangled physical reality.
How so? What physical theories predict its existence?
These are new frontiers for science...
ESP has been investigated for 100+ years without reliable success.
...and just like early Pavlov experiments have demonstrated most of us are driven by early conditioning and quite incapable of the type of critical thinking need to make that quantum leap.
That doesn't make any sense as an English sentence. What "quantum leap?"
SETI search for extraterrestrial intelligence an ambitious attempt to search for intelligent extraterrestrial life using rudimentary radio wave/frequencies opened the debate to better and more advanced means of communication.
That simply isn't true. High throughput and high security have always been goals for communications systems designers. It's hard to get that with radio.
If we want to connect and communicate with more intelligent beings we have to develop more intelligent communication systems to succeed.
That's certainly not true, unless the "more intelligent beings" don't want to communicate with us. If that is the case, then we'll definitely need to develop highly sophisticated methods for breaking into whatever communications systems they're using. If they want to talk with us, though, the idea that they won't or can't dumb it down for us needs to be supported. But what does this have to do with ESP?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  07:59:26   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
We just cannot discount the advances in neuroscience, neuropsychology and brain chemistry. The mapping of the brain with sophisticated modern equipment such as fMRI,EEG, PET. Science that takes a different approach to our understanding of the human brain and its hidden potential.

True ESP has been studied for decades but new brain scanning techniques are starting to narrow in on this phenomena.

There is a contrary position held my Stephen Hawking "Don't talk to aliens." http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/space/article7107207.ece

I already provided a link to some early study and suggested evidence of ESP. http://unitedcats.wordpress.com/2010/10/21/scientists-prove-that-humans-can-see-into-the-future/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Edited by - justintime on 09/23/2011 08:00:53
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  08:32:18   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime

We just cannot discount the advances in neuroscience, neuropsychology and brain chemistry. The mapping of the brain with sophisticated modern equipment such as fMRI,EEG, PET.
None of which has pointed to ESP. I'm not discounting the science or the tools, I'm discounting that for which there is no good evidence.
Science that takes a different approach to our understanding of the human brain and its hidden potential.
Different from what?
True ESP has been studied for decades but new brain scanning techniques are starting to narrow in on this phenomena.
The new brain scanning techniques aren't finding anything.
There is a contrary position held my Stephen Hawking "Don't talk to aliens." http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/space/article7107207.ece
I'm still not finding any relevance to ESP.
I already provided a link to some early study and suggested evidence of ESP. http://unitedcats.wordpress.com/2010/10/21/scientists-prove-that-humans-can-see-into-the-future/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
And James Alcock tore it to shreds:
Although Bem has failed to demonstrate the existence of mysterious intellectual powers that defy the normal constraints of time and space, there seem nonetheless to have been mysterious intellectual powers at play here. I refer to the decision by the editors of an esteemed psychology journal to publish this badly flawed research article.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  13:03:28   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
George Bush: 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2005/10_october/06/bush.shtml

Rick Perry, Latest Republican Presidential Candidate, Believes God Has Anointed Him to Run
http://millermps.wordpress.com/2011/08/12/rick-perry-latest-republican-presidential-candidate-believes-god-has-anointed-him-to-run/

God Guides Perry’s Life
http://freethoughtblogs.com/dispatches/2011/09/21/god-guides-perrys-life/

Here are some very prominent leaders President Bush(2 term president), Governor Perry (Presidential candidate) claiming to have communication with God. Now there is no scientific evidence to prove such communication is possible. You cannot dismiss them as crazy people either.

A scientific inquiry into the paranormal is just the beginning. Who knows science may yet find an explanation for this phenomena and it might be in the realm of ESP/PSI.

It took over 30 years before Mendels genetics was accepted. We have to keep an open mind.
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Machi4velli
SFN Regular

USA
854 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  14:03:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Machi4velli a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime
Here are some very prominent leaders President Bush(2 term president), Governor Perry (Presidential candidate) claiming to have communication with God. Now there is no scientific evidence to prove such communication is possible. You cannot dismiss them as crazy people either.


I can dismiss them as either actually fooling themselves into thinking they spoke to this god or being political opportunists/

A scientific inquiry into the paranormal is just the beginning. Who knows science may yet find an explanation for this phenomena and it might be in the realm of ESP/PSI.


We're not sure it's even a real phenomenon yet. Of course scientists will look if they're interested and have someone to fund their research, but we can't give the idea that it is real a privileged position above any other unconfirmed assertion.

"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
-Giordano Bruno

"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, but the illusion of knowledge."
-Stephen Hawking

"Seeking what is true is not seeking what is desirable"
-Albert Camus
Edited by - Machi4velli on 09/23/2011 14:11:20
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  15:08:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime

George Bush: 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2005/10_october/06/bush.shtml

Rick Perry, Latest Republican Presidential Candidate, Believes God Has Anointed Him to Run
http://millermps.wordpress.com/2011/08/12/rick-perry-latest-republican-presidential-candidate-believes-god-has-anointed-him-to-run/

God Guides Perry’s Life
http://freethoughtblogs.com/dispatches/2011/09/21/god-guides-perrys-life/

Here are some very prominent leaders President Bush(2 term president), Governor Perry (Presidential candidate) claiming to have communication with God. Now there is no scientific evidence to prove such communication is possible. You cannot dismiss them as crazy people either.
As Machi4velli noted, it's easy to dismiss them as liars or fools.
A scientific inquiry into the paranormal is just the beginning.
No, the Fox sisters began their fraud over 160 years ago, and research into the paranormal began shortly after that. The calls for more research from psi enthusiasts ring as desperate as those same calls coming from vaccine-autism proponents every time their pet hypothesis is squashed by facts.
Who knows science may yet find an explanation for this phenomena and it might be in the realm of ESP/PSI.
Science has already found either no phenomenon at all, or else deliberate or accidental cheating.
It took over 30 years before Mendels genetics was accepted.
Mendel wasn't asking people to believe in magic. He also had the amazing advantage of being (mostly) correct, and he had reams of data supporting his conclusions, which didn't rely upon barely significant results found after methodologically dubious massaging.

We have loads of data which points to one conclusion: that psi phenomena do not exist.
We have to keep an open mind.
But not so open that our brains fall out.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  16:00:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Scientist are working on genetic predispositions to certain political leanings such are liberal or conservative and that quite possible people are hardwired that way.
Scientist are also curious that human beings inherit a set of genes that predisposes them towards spiritual or mystic experiences.
So if you ignore what an open mind can accept. Can that be explained through genetic predisposition?
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  17:23:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime

Scientist are working on genetic predispositions to certain political leanings such are liberal or conservative and that quite possible people are hardwired that way.
Scientist are also curious that human beings inherit a set of genes that predisposes them towards spiritual or mystic experiences.
Nobody would deny that spiritual or mystic experiences happen, but that's no good reason to think that anything spiritual or mystic actually occurs. Not when we've got tons and tons of solid data on illusions and delusions and hallucinations and outright fraud.
So if you ignore what an open mind can accept.
A completely open mind can accept that the sky is yellow, grass is transparent and that cars are fueled by rainbows. There must be a limit to how open one keeps one's mind, or one must believe everything. Even "this sentence is false."
Can that be explained through genetic predisposition?
You think gullibility might be genetic?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  18:35:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

You think gullibility might be genetic?

I cannot prove it but I can surely try.
Point 5,6,7 is unusually high for a developed nation considering Christianity is a small Jewish sectarian religion which was exported to Rome. Constantine declared Christianity to be one of the religions approved by him in 313 A.D.

1. 1970's pet rocks. sold millions on a fad and gullibility of people.
2. 50 percent of Americans still believe that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction when Bush invaded that country,
3. 64 percent of Americans still believe that Saddam Hussein had strong links with Al Qaeda.
4. 38 per cent saying they are not convinced Obama their president was born in America
5. 76% identify themselves as Christians
6. 40 percent claim to attend services nearly
7. 58 percent claim to pray at least weekly
8. only 40% of Americans believe in evolution.
9. 56 percent of adults in the poll who believe it is very likely or somewhat likely that intelligent life exists on other worlds.
10. 26.2 percent of Americans ages 18 and older or about one in four adults suffer from a diagnosable mental disorder in a given year.

These statistics are not replicable in any other part of the world and suggest there is some correlation between gullibility and genetics.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  19:45:43   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime

Originally posted by Dave W.

You think gullibility might be genetic?
I cannot prove it but I can surely try.
Point 5,6,7 is unusually high for a developed nation...
You think that the United States of America is genetically isolated from the rest of the world? You must be very open-minded, indeed.

Seriously: you do realize that by attempting to show that the U.S.A. is abnormally gullible undermines whatever argument you were trying to make for ESP and psi just a few comments ago, right?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2011 :  19:48:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by justintime
These statistics are not replicable in any other part of the world and suggest there is some correlation between gullibility and genetics.
Even if that is true (which it isn't), why would you presume there to be a genetic factor when America is a melting pot of people from all over the world? If America is an outlier, the most likely explanation would be cultural.

But gullibility is not a uniquely American problem, I'm afraid. Scam artist "holy men" exploit the poor in India, the Chinese kill endangered tigers for sham medicinals, while half the people living in the Middle East don't believe the Holocaust ever happened. There's plenty of stupid to go around.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
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justintime
BANNED

382 Posts

Posted - 09/24/2011 :  06:37:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send justintime a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W. Seriously: you do realize that by attempting to show that the U.S.A. is abnormally gullible undermines whatever argument you were trying to make for ESP and psi just a few comments ago, right?

You have a point there. DARYL J. BEM is a Professor of Psychology at Cornell University. Michigan. It is hard to determine his own gullibility for taking ESP/PSI seriously, or his genetic disposition for the spiritual or mystic experiences. Nor can we be certain he played to the gullibility of Americans. But what we can be certain about is he is American and statistics show 75% of Americans profess at least one paranormal belief. The most popular is extrasensory perception (ESP), mentioned by 41%.

Culture affects genes and vice versa. These mutual interactions between DNA and culture: the so-called “gene-culture co-evolution i.e reciprocal interactions between human culture and human genes are also evidence for natural selection in our species, and how that selection might have been affected by our culture (and vice versa). A culture of gullibility is contagious one might ascertain.

Should the recognition of our own gullibility prevent us from being receptive to the paranormal? I am sure DARYL J. BEM considered the skeptics before publishing his research which was peer reviewed. There are many unexplained mysteries beyond the realm of science to prove or disprove and ESP/PSI has its skeptics and believers. With 41% of Americans endorsing it...raises the bar for Presidential candidates to possess this talent.
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