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 An Uncommon Descent into Lamackism
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HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2008 :  15:28:25  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Jeet Swesus, the ID Creationists will write anything to avoid accepting the Theory of Evolution by Natural Selection. Including suggesting that acquired characteristics are inherited! Which is, of course, Lamarckism, a cruder theory that preceded Darwin. A cruder theory of evolution, that is.

Jean-Baptiste Lamarck theorized that the ancestors of modern giraffes, for instance, had grown longer necks simply because stretching to reach tree vegetation would give birth to longer-necked progeny. Lamarck, these days, is usually touched upon in high school biology classes for historical background, and giggles, just prior to introducing Darwin.

The subject of the Uncommon Descent article is a study of a lizard species (by real scientists, not tards) which had been transplanted from one Adriatic island to another (the lizards, not the scientists). ("Here we show how lizards have rapidly evolved differences in head morphology, bite strength, and digestive tract structure after experimental introduction into a novel environment") The lizards made huge and undeniable evolutionary changes in just forty years. (This lizard apparently subsists entirely upon the souls of Creationists.)

So there is an actual experiment showing evolution by natural selection. "PaV" is the writer of this article at UD. Obviously sensing yet another Creation-killing discovery, PaV puts it this way:
There seems to be two ways of looking at this: (1) that NS has brought all of these changes about; or (2) the environment, specifically the proteins/enzymes/chemicals of the plant life on the new Adriatic island has interacted with the genome to quickly bring about these changes.
No actual biochemical pathway is suggested by PaV for this "interaction" to occur. What an unevidenced but "sciency" way to put it! And it's presented as if PaV thinks Lamarckism is the hottest cutting-edge science. These folks, one must admit from time to time, are just precious.

Funnier yet, Lamarckian evolution, if it were true, would be just as much of a problem for Creationists as Darwinian evolution! Just the sort of excreta we have come to expect from the Tardmeisters of Intelligent Design.


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.

Edited by - HalfMooner on 04/18/2008 16:19:48

Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26015 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2008 :  16:48:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It's not so much Lamarckism that he's advocating, but "front loading." He's thinking that the lizard DNA was pre-programmed to respond to the plants on the new island in a certain way.

If taken to Dave Scot extremes, the earlier creature on Earth contained every gene required to make every gene in evidence today, under just the right circumstances, all pre-triggered and intelligently designed. (For example, certain bacteria were designed so that they would change in order to be able to digest Nylon once Nylon was invented.) And all pre-planned to climax in animals called "human beings" who kill Jesus.

But some of the commenters clearly show that the pattern of thought at UD is "random mutation and natural selection (RM+NS) can't have done this, so let's dream up a way that it could," and then they pat each other on the back for disproving Darwin.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2008 :  19:17:06   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think this "front-loading" thing is just a "goddidit" form of Lamarckism devoid of Lamarck's naturalism. I certainly agree that the ID Creationists are dreaming furiously, to come up with a notion that is inferior to one that was discarded by science after Origin of the Species.


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26015 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2008 :  21:36:10   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by HalfMooner

I think this "front-loading" thing is just a "goddidit" form of Lamarckism devoid of Lamarck's naturalism.
But of course! Lamarck might say that some proto-giraffe stretched its own neck to reach higher leaves, but it doesn't tell us why there were proto-giraffes to begin with.

Front-loading (known to the AtBC crowd as "pant-loading" for obvious reasons - bngbuck ought to like that one) tells us why in every case: because the designer wanted things that way. We can't know the designer's intent (since we're not allowed to discuss the designer), but it's quite clear that the designer made sure that we would be created. Who else could possibly marvel at the designer's designs?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard

USA
3739 Posts

Posted - 04/19/2008 :  06:28:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit marfknox's Homepage  Send marfknox an AOL message Send marfknox a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Everyone should learn about Lamarck's theory in school if only to understand what evolutionary theory is not. I remember a preacher on the oval at Ohio State once denouncing evolution, and in his sermonizing he was describing Lamarck's ideas as part of the theory of evolution (he didn't name Lamarck, but he was describing that process.) And nobody was correcting him until finally a friend of mine did, and was met with a blank stare of incomprehension, and ultimately nothing was achieved.

"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong

Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com

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bngbuck
SFN Addict

USA
2437 Posts

Posted - 04/19/2008 :  15:38:57   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send bngbuck a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Dave.....

Front-loading (known to the AtBC crowd as "pant-loading" for obvious reasons - bngbuck ought to like that one)

Tenebrous Tard turd tales tend to tittilate those thespians (like me) theeking (ouch!) tub-thumping!
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26015 Posts

Posted - 04/19/2008 :  18:02:56   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by bngbuck

...theeking...
I'd guess you're familiar with The Thong of Thor.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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