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 Keeping track of Ham's Ark Park
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13352 Posts

Posted - 10/23/2016 :  20:17:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

A much more detailed we spent $40 so you don't have to.
Sooo... He's pretty much saying the science is dodgy. Who'd a thunk it?

I doubt I'll ever visit the place, and probably wouldn't even if I were in Kentucky. But someone had to do it. A good (as in well written) review.

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 02/18/2017 :  15:12:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh, goody, a new diorama!
Creationist and Christian fundamentalist Ken Ham believes that in ancient times humans and dinosaurs co-existed with a race of giants and they all did battle with each other in gladiator-style combat.
In Roman-style arenas, too.

Apparently, the dinosaur kinda embarrassed Ham for a little while. On the 16th he Tweeted this image (note dino coming out of doorway in upper-left image):



But if you go back and look at that Tweet now, you'll see this image, without dino:



Clicking on it would give you the full spread, so the dino was merely hidden behind a mouse click:



But now, two days later, the dino is back:



It's so cute that Kenny thinks he's doing something productive for society, and so can judge the rest of us.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Christian Hedonist
Skeptic Friend

97 Posts

Posted - 02/22/2017 :  14:53:06   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Christian Hedonist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is this:

http://www.snopes.com/noahs-ark-park-flooded/

I think it would be destroyed in a flood, I doubt that thing will float.

This Ark Park is unnecessary and a waste of money. $40 per person? It would cost me $188 to bring my family. I don't think so. Christians should leave science to scientists.
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9646 Posts

Posted - 02/27/2017 :  06:19:08   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Christians should leave science to scientists.

I started to shout "AMEN to that!" but then I changed my mind.

Christians should inform themselves from scientists. Not the other way around.


Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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Christian Hedonist
Skeptic Friend

97 Posts

Posted - 03/10/2017 :  10:51:09   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Christian Hedonist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse

Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Christians should leave science to scientists.

I started to shout "AMEN to that!" but then I changed my mind.

Christians should inform themselves from scientists. Not the other way around.


I don't disagree. My opinion is that some Christians put too much emphasis on creation and young earth. They believe you must believe these things to be saved. My position is it is not a salvation issue. You can believe evolution and old earth and still be saved. Although I don't believe the two are reconcilable.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 03/10/2017 :  21:36:01   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

They believe you must believe these things to be saved.
No, actually, they don't.

They believe that if the Bible is wrong about anything, then the Bible might be wrong about salvation. So if even one jot or tittle is incorrect in the Bible, then they have no clue as to whether everlasting life is real. It scares the pants off them.

So, to deny the fear, they insist that the Bible is right and evolution is wrong. They insist that the Ark was a real ocean-going vessel built about 4,200 years ago, and that the grasshoppers on board must have had only four legs. That everyone spoke the same language until the Shinarians screwed it all up through hubris. That Jesus passed both one and two blind men when leaving Jericho. That Jesus ascended from both Bethany and Mount Olivet. Etc.

The lack of faith displayed by these people is pretty spectacular, considering that they insist that salvation comes only through faith (despite the Bible also saying that it can come from words, or good works, or believing what Peter said, or believing what Paul said, etc.). They cannot abide metaphors, and insist upon solid black-and-white boundaries for everything.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Christian Hedonist
Skeptic Friend

97 Posts

Posted - 03/16/2017 :  13:54:08   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Christian Hedonist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

They believe you must believe these things to be saved.
No, actually, they don't.

They believe that if the Bible is wrong about anything, then the Bible might be wrong about salvation. So if even one jot or tittle is incorrect in the Bible, then they have no clue as to whether everlasting life is real. It scares the pants off them.

So, to deny the fear, they insist that the Bible is right and evolution is wrong. They insist that the Ark was a real ocean-going vessel built about 4,200 years ago, and that the grasshoppers on board must have had only four legs. That everyone spoke the same language until the Shinarians screwed it all up through hubris. That Jesus passed both one and two blind men when leaving Jericho. That Jesus ascended from both Bethany and Mount Olivet. Etc.

The lack of faith displayed by these people is pretty spectacular, considering that they insist that salvation comes only through faith (despite the Bible also saying that it can come from words, or good works, or believing what Peter said, or believing what Paul said, etc.). They cannot abide metaphors, and insist upon solid black-and-white boundaries for everything.


Here is Ken Ham quote:

"Now, I want to make very clear that belief in a historical Adam and Eve is not a salvation issue per se, but it is a biblical authority issue and a gospel issue.”

So he says it is not a salvation issue but then says it is a gospel issue which is a salvation issue. Ken Ham and the like may not say it is a salvation issue, but they will sure question your Christianity if you do believe in evolution.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 03/16/2017 :  19:26:12   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Christian Hedonist

Here is Ken Ham quote:

"Now, I want to make very clear that belief in a historical Adam and Eve is not a salvation issue per se, but it is a biblical authority issue and a gospel issue.”
That's what I was saying. They think if the Bible is "wrong" in any way, then that diminishes its authority. If the Bible isn't absolutely authoritative, then how can anyone know that faith in Jesus is the way to salvation?

Ken Ham and the like may not say it is a salvation issue, but they will sure question your Christianity if you do believe in evolution.
Ken Ham will question your Christianity if it isn't precisely like his. As I said, black-and-white boundaries.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 05/26/2017 :  09:13:20   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A giant ark is just the start. These creationists have a bigger plan for recruiting new believers.:
But the project’s single largest source of funding was actually $62 million in junk bonds floated by the town of Willamstown, population less than 4,000, home to the Ark Encounter and the county seat of Grant County, which faced bankruptcy this spring.

“In terms of revenue for the county, we don’t get too much from them,” says the county’s chief executive, Stephen Wood. The Ark Encounter negotiated a vastly discounted 30-year rate on property taxes in 2013 under a previous administration. “I hate it, but that’s the deal,” says Wood.

...

Ham argues that his organization received a tourist tax break while creating jobs in a region battered by the economy.

Kentucky residents “should be thankful we’re here,” he says. “We’re creating all these extra jobs in the community, which wouldn’t be there if we weren’t here.”

Perhaps, but a year after the ark opened, downtown Williamstown, about two miles from the tourist attraction, still isn’t much more than a collection of resale and “antiques” shops and shuttered storefronts. At lunchtime on a spring weekday, Main Street was devoid of pedestrians, tour buses or open restaurants, except for a coffee shop with a tattoo parlor in the back.

...

The ark is not completed. Still to open is an 800-seat restaurant on the top deck, where guests will be entertained by Noah-era reenactors, a Bible-inspired dinner theater.

The biblical theme park, ultimately featuring 80 structures, will be built gradually. The founders hope to open a new attraction every year. Next up is a 2,500-seat auditorium for events at the Ark Encounter, scheduled to open next spring. The Noah-era walled city comes after that. “Picture Disney Main Street with lots of shops, food and fun things to see,” says Zovath.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13352 Posts

Posted - 06/14/2017 :  12:26:36   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Creationist Ken Ham Blames Atheists For Ark Park Failure

Recently, a number of articles in the mainstream media, on blogs, and on well-known secularist group websites have attempted to spread propaganda to brainwash the public into thinking our Ark Encounter attraction is a dismal failure.

Sadly, they (atheists and the secular media) are influencing business investors and others in such a negative way that they may prevent Grant County, Kentucky, from achieving the economic recovery that its officials and residents have been seeking.
- Ken Ham

What else could it be? Darned atheists ruin everything.

Bottom line: Ham is a sad monkey. His Ark Encounter and Creation Museum are not performing as well as he had hoped they would, and now he is refusing to take responsibility for his own failure, and instead blaming atheists and the secular media.



Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

United Kingdom
1249 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2017 :  20:38:20   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
the problem with this ark is that it sounds TOO fun. Ham wants to make it like Disneyland which is pretty much a pagan witch cult. There's nothing fun about the sacrifices Noah and his family had to make.

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2017 :  21:22:55   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
PZ Myers visited Ham's Ark:
After visiting the Creation “Museum”, I thought it was a reasonable, responsible action for scientists to visit it to see what they’re up against. I can’t make the same recommendation for the Ark Park. There’s nothing of interest or value there, and it’s so poorly designed that no objective perspective could find it even entertaining.

Stay home. Put a wooden crate on a dirt pile. Have a friend grunt and make funny animal noises. Meditate upon it.

There. You have just replicated the Ark Encounter Experience, and you don’t have to spend $43.50 on it (that’s what it cost me. I shamelessly got the Senior Citizen’s discount, which is the first time I’ve done that.)

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2017 :  21:25:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

There's nothing fun about the sacrifices Noah and his family had to make.
What "sacrifices" precisely? They're the only ones who lived, allegedly.

Or is it the case that in your book, dying unsaved is easier than living?

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13352 Posts

Posted - 06/19/2017 :  09:38:24   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
OFFC:
the problem with this ark is that it sounds TOO fun.

Now there's a rub. I have read several first hand accounts of the tour/adventure, and not a single one of them makes it sound like a fun thing to do. In fact, it's my guess if anyone had any fun, it was those who wanted to see this creationist mess. You know... Skeptics. For example, my tour through the ICR creationist museum was fun and depressing at the same time. Laugh out loud exhibits were there along with families with children who were learning that their teachers were lying to them. That part was sad.

I did get to meet Duane Gish, creator of The Gish Gallop style of debating that Kent Hovind perfected. That was a trip.

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25856 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2017 :  10:28:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
PZ Myers has irked Ken Ham:
But mainly I listened because they spent about 5 minutes at the beginning talking about me. An atheist visited the Ark Park, shock horror, and he mocked everything. Ken has all my tweets printed out, and he was disgusted. How dare I say there wasn’t much information in the big wooden box? That seems to be what miffed them most. From the timing of my tweets, he calculated that I only spent an hour and 15 minutes in there, so I must have been racing through everything — why, when he personally takes groups through and explains everything, it takes about 2 hours to do the tour.

It sure felt like it was a lot longer than that — there was a lot of time spent slowly wending through ridiculously prolonged tours of empty boxes. But sure, I’ll believe it was objectively an hour and a quarter. I didn’t have to run to do that time though. It was more like a slow stroll, stopping at each room and display, and taking pictures. So once again, Ken Ham confirms my impression of the paucity of material in there.

He complains that I said the parking lot was ten times larger than it needed to be — it’s only twice as large, he said. No, that’s not true. I got there late in the morning, and got a parking spot right near the shuttle bus pick up, and sure drove a long way through empty spaces to get there.

About the weathered look of the outside of the ark — he says they intended it that way. OK. I guess grey is an attractive color.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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