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Dr Shari
Skeptic Friend
135 Posts |
 Posted - 05/22/2002 : 23:48:49
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Well it seems sadly the worse has been proven true. The Washington Intern is dead. Found not 4 miles from her home where she was murdered while jogging. I believe that soon all the innuendoes and talk that Congressman Gary Condit had her done in will soon be over. I always believed he was neither important enough nor threatened enough by the fact that he had had yet another affair to need to have her murdered or kill her himself.
The sexual exploits by men and women of power does not seem to be of much real interest to the voters of this country and as for myself I am much more interested in how those people I have voted for are upholding their promises to clean up the enviorment or improve healthcare then who they are having sex with.
Most past Presidents have had their affairs. Eisenhower had his lover with him for over 20 years, FDR's wife was not with him at his death because SHE felt his mistress was the one should be there. The Kennedy's are legendary and Clinton became a joke.
The important thing about Condit and Levy and his unsuccessful bid for reelection is it proves the basic rule of politics.. You Are Never Finished In Washington Until You Are Caught In Bed With a Dead Girl or A Live Boy.
He did not kill her in my estimation but if she wanted to ruin him because of the broken heart of a young girl caused by the lies of an older man of power getting herself murdered in an random act of violence though excessive was totally effective.
I am sorry for the lose of the Levy family but I am also sad for Gary Condit. Two families were destroyed by the a crazed crime of violence against a woman who had so much to live for and a man who served his country well enough to be elected for three decades.I hope both families find peace.
Death: The High Cost of Living
It is easier to get forgiveness then to get permission!
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 00:06:50 [Permalink]
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quote:
I always believed he was neither important enough nor threatened enough by the fact that he had had yet another affair to need to have her murdered or kill her himself.
The sexual exploits by men and women of power does not seem to be of much real interest to the voters of this country and as for myself I am much more interested in how those people I have voted for are upholding their promises to clean up the enviorment or improve healthcare then who they are having sex with.
Totaly agree with you on both points.
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Clinton became a joke.
I never could understand why they were going after him with such a vengence.....UNLESS, it was to take the spotlight off of anything they were doing. (Planning to overthrow the up coming election, just a thought!)
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He did not kill her in my estimation but if she wanted to ruin him because of the broken heart of a young girl caused by the lies of an older man of power getting herself murdered in an random act of violence though excessive was totally effective.
LOL
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Two families were destroyed by the a crazed crime of violence against a woman who had so much to live for and a man who served his country well enough to be elected for three decades.I hope both families find peace.
I do agree with you again.
However I think he is kind of creepy and she must have been smart enough to know what Washington is like but that is still no reason for what happened to everyone involved.
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*Carabao forever.
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Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 00:08:05 [Permalink]
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I think Condit's political suicide started when people were thinking "this guy is stonewalling". Time, money, and resources were spent trying to get a straight answer from the guy. If at the outset, he'd said "yeah, we had an affair, but now this is between my wife and I", he'd have probably been re-elected. I'm given to understand he was quite popular. Instead, we have a missing (and face it, we all thought she was probably dead) girl, while Condit was acting like a kid caught in the cookie jar and trying to save his political ass.
The people I feel for right now are the Levy's. They've just learned the worst, and they've got half the damn media in the country camped in front of their house. One report I read said they were "waiting for a comment or reaction" from the Levy's. Allah to Zeus people! First their daughter was missing, now confirmed dead. WTF do people think they're reaction is going to be? CNN should pack it in and go do something they're competant at: follow around some movie stars.
Lisa
[/rant]
We have enough youth. We need a fountain of smart. |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 07:58:47 [Permalink]
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quote:
The sexual exploits by men and women of power does not seem to be of much real interest to the voters of this country and as for myself I am much more interested in how those people I have voted for are upholding their promises to clean up the enviorment or improve healthcare then who they are having sex with.
This sentiment seems to be common, but it has always puzzled me.
A person who has an affair betrays someone he has claimed to love, honor, and cherish, purely for personal gratification.
How in the world can someone trust a politician who has displayed this tendency to betray a loved one? Surely they wouldn't think twice in betraying their constituents, of whom they don't share any kind of love or promise as intimate as marriage.
A politician who cheats on their spouse may be doing a good job otherwise, but I would much rather find someone to represent me who will do do just as good a job, without worrying about their betraying our interests for their own personal gain.
Hell, isn't the risk of blackmail enough to want these losers out of office? The FBI considers this a very high security risk, yet people don't care if their President engages in this potentially disastrous conduct?!
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Truth above pride and ego; truth above all |
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Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 08:58:12 [Permalink]
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quote:
How in the world can someone trust a politician who has displayed this tendency to betray a loved one? Surely they wouldn't think twice in betraying their constituents,
I'm spending more time than I ever wanted to working with primates these days. When I started this I looked upon their activites as dim reflections, parodies, of our own. Now I realize that I had that backwards -- their behavior is the basic behavior that our more complex behavior is built on.
Among apes the Alpha male will place himself in danger for the protection of the group. That doesn't sound like some thing you would want to do. Yet all the young bucks want to be the Alpha male. The main reason is sex. The females are all turned on by the Alpha-ness.
The second reason is food. The Alpha gets the first pick of the goodies.
The third is adulation. If the Alpha wants to be socially groomed--the bugs picked off him-- all day long, he's got it!
Why would the rest of us trust a politician who has displayed this tendency to betray a loved one? Because it is built into us to do so. The idea that this is a betrayal is much more superficial than the idea of the Alpha's "rights."
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My business is to teach my aspirations to conform themselves to fact, not to try and make facts harmonize with my aspirations. ---Thomas Henry Huxley, 1860
Edited by - slater on 05/23/2002 08:59:14 |
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PhDreamer
SFN Regular
USA
925 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 08:58:13 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
The sexual exploits by men and women of power does not seem to be of much real interest to the voters of this country and as for myself I am much more interested in how those people I have voted for are upholding their promises to clean up the enviorment or improve healthcare then who they are having sex with.
This sentiment seems to be common, but it has always puzzled me.
A person who has an affair betrays someone he has claimed to love, honor, and cherish, purely for personal gratification.
I think this happens often enough that the simple answer might be that we don't have as developed a sense of love/honor as we do sexual gratification.
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How in the world can someone trust a politician who has displayed this tendency to betray a loved one? Surely they wouldn't think twice in betraying their constituents, of whom they don't share any kind of love or promise as intimate as marriage.
I don't see how the two situations are comparable. Affairs are often spur-of-the-moment, emotional, short term occurrences. I can't imagine most political decisions are made this way. And though I don't have any citations, I don't believe there's a 'betrayal center' in the brain that generalizes to multiple situations. I think these kinds of decisions are situational.
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A politician who cheats on their spouse may be doing a good job otherwise, but I would much rather find someone to represent me who will do do just as good a job, without worrying about their betraying our interests for their own personal gain.
Good luck. We aren't exactly awash with choices these days.
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Hell, isn't the risk of blackmail enough to want these losers out of office? The FBI considers this a very high security risk, yet people don't care if their President engages in this potentially disastrous conduct?!
Now this is something to be concerned about. The FBI's answer is probably to harass the potential blackmailer, however.
Generally speaking, the errors in religion are dangerous; those in philosophy only ridiculous.
-D. Hume |
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Xev
Skeptic Friend
USA
329 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 09:46:51 [Permalink]
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Tokyodreamer:
"A person who has an affair betrays someone he has claimed to love, honor, and cherish, purely for personal gratification."
Why say ye that? The phenomena of the 'open marriage' seems common enough among pols, who, after all, rarely marry for reasons of love.
Doc Shari:
"He did not kill her in my estimation but if she wanted to ruin him because of the broken heart of a young girl caused by the lies of an older man of power getting herself murdered in an random act of violence though excessive was totally effective."
'Fraid I don't follow you - she commited suicide in order to ruin him?
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!Go Wings!
- Cthulhu Saves! - |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 10:15:27 [Permalink]
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Eh, so maybe I'm being too idealistic. I just think people like Bill Clinton and Newt Gingrich are scummy for having repeated affairs (there's no evidence that either's marriages were "open", and quite a bit that says they probably weren't; if they were, it'd be a different scenario of course).
It hints at a level of egocentrism that I find highly undesirable in people with power over me.
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Truth above pride and ego; truth above all
Edited by - tokyodreamer on 05/23/2002 10:15:57 |
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Hook
Skeptic Friend
USA
79 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 11:09:48 [Permalink]
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It hints at a level of egocentrism that I find highly undesirable in people with power over me.
Either you are too idealistic or I am too cynical. What do you think it takes to get and be in those positions. There may be exceptions, but they are few (Jimmy Carter was one, I believe). Generally, there are just those that hide it well and those that don't.
I think Slater has the best analysis. By the way, this marraige for "love" stuff is pretty modern stuff, invented in the 12th Century (Europe), I believe and took awhile to catch on. Hollywood revisionist history has been happy to carry on the Troubadors' tradition.
At heart, we're still hunter gatherers-- meat for sex and all that.  
I really don't care what a politician does with his or her private life, just as I don't want them to care about what I do with mine. I care more about who they are screwing with their policies than who they are screwing in a motel room. That's what the right wing doesn't get.
(P-)>
"There are no holy signs below the waist, folks!" Justin Green |
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Hook
Skeptic Friend
USA
79 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2002 : 11:18:43 [Permalink]
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Hell, isn't the risk of blackmail enough to want these losers out of office? The FBI considers this a very high security risk, yet people don't care if their President engages in this potentially disastrous conduct?!
This has always been overblown and largely was used in the past to discriminate in security clearances against homosexuals (that practice has largely stopped). Find me a case where someone was being "blackmailed" for secrets. People betray their country largely for one reason--good old monetary gain. Sad, isn't it.
(P-)>
"There are no holy signs below the waist, folks!" Justin Green |
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Dr Shari
Skeptic Friend
135 Posts |
Posted - 05/25/2002 : 20:17:40 [Permalink]
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A politician breaks his marriage vows then like most husbands caught lies about it and we wonder if he his fit to be in public office. Would you rather he stood up and said straight out "Hell, yes I sleep around on my wife" and then air his private laundry in public or try to protect his family? I think what happens is they get themselves painted into a corner just like every other human being.
If we need a Separation of Church and State clause in the Constitution them maybe our next Amendment should be the Separation of Sex and State. I hope there is a great deal of distance between the bedroom and Capitol Hill.
Death: The High Cost of Living
It is easier to get forgiveness then to get permission! |
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Lars_H
SFN Regular
Germany
630 Posts |
Posted - 05/26/2002 : 12:29:56 [Permalink]
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I think that one problem here is that people don't elect human beings. They elect idealized fictions. If they were willing to elect someone, who is actually human, they would not be so suprised to find out that their politicans actually are just that, human.
If the people were willing to elect someone who had a divorce, they could avoid getting someone whose marriage is just a publicity sham.
I don't care very much about a politicians maritial fidelity, but about his competence.
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Chagur
New Member
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 06/19/2002 : 17:59:14 [Permalink]
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Word to the wise: Don't have the press discover you peccadillo when there's little news around.
How much coverage would the matter have received post-9/11?
Take care.
"Fie, fie how franticly I square my talk!" -Edwin A. Abbott - |
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