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Badman
New Member
United Kingdom
20 Posts |
 Posted - 11/28/2003 : 10:49:52
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Refreshing after 40 years to see a documentary that says Oswald was the lone assassin. Guy in front of JFK car sits slightly to the left of JFK hence the magic bullet theory. MAthematical mapping of scene shows that Oswald did it alone. Some 4th bullet theory is a fake. And Oswald had 98% accuracy at a distance of 200 yards. Kennedy car was a mere 50 yards or so. Lastly, the six seconds for three rounds was untrue - it was nearly 8 seconds.
I had some conspiracy nut show me a video where he believed that the driver of the car turned around and shot Kennedy in the head. PUssy. I LOOKED REAL HARD to try to see it but i failed (my eyesight is great )
As we all know, Oswald was a communist pretty much. He said "MArxist-Lenonist". Terrible world we live in really where one nutcase can kill a president. What hope do the rest of us have? Anonymity is probably productive of a long life...
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 11/28/2003 : 14:37:05 [Permalink]
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I don't know.....
I am not and have never been comfortable with the 'Ozwald-done-it-alone' theory, but have no theory of my own to offer. My son-in-law thinks it was a mob hit, and makes a pretty good argument for it.
Re: the rifle. It was a cheap, mail-order piece, surplus, WW-II vintage. The desigh dates back to WW-I. As I recall, they were calling it an Argentine Mauser' at the time. These and others like them, were very common and you could buy them for next to nothing. They were also garbage, as far as accuratcy is concerned. It fired a 7.62 mm cartridge. This has a fair amount of recoil, although not in the class of the American Springfielf A3-03 -- also available at the time for only a few more $$. The Springfield was much more accurate. Both used the 'Mauser' action, and variaions of that are still around today in modern, bolt-action arms.
The rifle also had a 'scope. Believe it or not, a 'scope, especally one with a small eye apreture, will actually slow the following shots down, except in the hands of a master marksman. It takes time to re-locate the target, a shade longer than with open sights.
So, Ozwald would have to fire the first one, work the bolt while recovering from the recoil, reaquire the target, line up on it, and fire again. Three accurate shots in 6 -- ok, 8 seconds, at more or less 50 yards, shooting downhill, from a rifle that was little better than a wall-hanger from a marksman's point of view (their head spacing was sloppy and they had oversized chambers. Their triggers were beyond stiff with lots of backlash. Forget accuratcy! 98% accuratcy at a mere 200 yards ain't all that great. How small was the target and how many shots were fired at it? Were they fired standing, or from a rest?).
I don't think that I could do it, and I'm pretty good. At one time, I was very good, shooting a lot of match, and I doubt if I could have done it even then; certainly not with the Ozwald piece.
There's more than just shitty rifles in the hands of idiots, and bullets coming from odd angles: How the hell did the Dallas cops become so incompent that Jack Ruby, who himself, died in jail not long after, could blow Ozwald, a prize prisoner, away? Why was the autopsy done with such confusion, after shuffling the body from pillar to post? How could a bullet, soft lead in a copper jacket, found on JFK's gurney, be in all but pristine condition after alledgly plowing through flesh and bone?
And so forth.
Questions, questions, eh? While I consider the Warren report to be a crock, I have not the evidence to form a theory of my own. At this late date, I doubt if I ever will.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 11/28/2003 14:44:29 |
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Vegeta
Skeptic Friend
United Kingdom
238 Posts |
Posted - 11/28/2003 : 17:03:50 [Permalink]
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The documentary was convincing because it dissected both types of conspiracy. The 'multiple gunmen' one, and the 'lone gunman under control by the powers that be' one. Firstly giving iron clad evidence that Oswald could have and most likely did shoot Kennedy alone, and then dissecting Oswald and Ruby's pasts and personalities to show they probably did act of their own accord.
Predictably though it was completely one sided and gave no scrap of evidence for the conspiracy theories. For example they showed that it was possible to fire off 3 rounds in 7 seconds, or whatever it was. But didn't explain how witnesses heard two of the shots very close together, (which would be next to impossible with that weapon). They didn't explain why people heard gunshots from the grassy knoll, there's other stuff too which I've forgotton. But if you look around you can find good conspiracy sites which don't use the cliched and disproven/fabricated theries from Oliver Stone's JFK |
What are you looking at? Haven't you ever seen a pink shirt before?
"I was asked if I would do a similar sketch but focusing on the shortcomings of Islam rather than Christianity. I said, 'No, no I wouldn't. I may be an atheist but I'm not stupid.'" - Steward Lee |
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Renae
SFN Regular
543 Posts |
Posted - 11/28/2003 : 19:30:03 [Permalink]
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Count me a Small Conspiracy Believer.
I was sick this week, and while couch-bound I watched hours of TV on the assassination. Fascinating for me; I was born years after it happened.
I don't think the conspiracy reached the highest level of government, nor do I think LBJ, Castro, or Russia were involved. It seems, however, that Oswald and Ruby both had mob connections. Even if there wasn't a second shooter (and I think there likely was), the mob still could have been quietly involved.
It's another case of wishful thinking for me, too. I must admit that. I don't want to believe that Oswald acted alone. Every time I watch the Zapruder film, I want there to be a different ending, one where Oswald misses or JFK ducks or something. I feel the same when I watch RFK's last speech. I just want it to end differently.
Not to thread-jack, but I wonder if LBJ did a better job than perhaps Kennedy could have done in getting programs through congress--like the Civil Rights Act. And I bet they're both spinning in their graves these days watching Great Society programs being dismantled by an overgrown frat boy.
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Maverick
Skeptic Friend
Sweden
385 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2004 : 14:32:35 [Permalink]
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| As it looks right now, Oswald was probably the killer, yes. But I'm still not sure if there's more to it than that, and in that case, what? The film you mention is quite famous, and I too have debated with someone who thought it was the driver who shot JFK. As we can see, this is not correct at all, as we see the exit wound in his forehead. |
"Life is but a momentary glimpse of the wonder of this astonishing universe, and it is sad to see so many dreaming it away on spiritual fantasy." -- Carl Sagan |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2004 : 07:16:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Badman
Refreshing after 40 years to see a documentary that says Oswald was the lone assassin. Guy in front of JFK car sits slightly to the left of JFK hence the magic bullet theory. MAthematical mapping of scene shows that Oswald did it alone. Some 4th bullet theory is a fake. And Oswald had 98% accuracy at a distance of 200 yards. Kennedy car was a mere 50 yards or so. Lastly, the six seconds for three rounds was untrue - it was nearly 8 seconds.
I had some conspiracy nut show me a video where he believed that the driver of the car turned around and shot Kennedy in the head. PUssy. I LOOKED REAL HARD to try to see it but i failed (my eyesight is great)
As we all know, Oswald was a communist pretty much. He said "MArxist-Lenonist". Terrible world we live in really where one nutcase can kill a president. What hope do the rest of us have? Anonymity is probably productive of a long life...
I still have doubts. I do not find the Warren Commission's finding credible. The Magic Bullet theory still has several inches of drop to account for, not just left to right movement. Although I have seen some programs which claim Oswald acted alone, most ignore the three dimentional problem.
It was a confused site to say the least. Rifle reports echoing around making the source of the shooting difficult to determine, the weapon siezed being of inferior quality and stiff action, the pristine bullet, all cast serious question on whether Oswald did it. While Oswald appears to have wanted to kill the President, I have seen a theory of a mob hit. It seems more credible than Oswald. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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