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furshur
SFN Regular

USA
1536 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  08:38:00  Show Profile Send furshur a Private Message
I was talking to a christian friend of mine and he started talking about the 'New World Order', so I asked him what that meant to him. He told me that it is one world goverment. I rather horrified him by saying I thought it is a great idea.
What would be wrong with one goverment? I realize a world goverment would not to eliminate all of the problems, and terrorism would probably be a bigger problem than it is now.
But one goverment would GREATLY decrease the chance of us blowing ourselves up in a nuclear war. I would imagine that not pouring trillions of dollars into defense could only have a positive effect on the economy.
I am not saying it will ever happen, but what would be wrong with a central world goverment?




If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know.

Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26020 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  10:03:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message
But, but, but... America wouldn't be for Americans, then!

Seriously, I have no idea if the above is one of the "problems" with a world government.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  10:07:59   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
Way back in the late 1940's, I had a teacher who once said that given the speed of the day's transportation and communication, the entire world could be goverened fron a single point. I believed it then and still do; even more so, considering the advances made, especally in communication.

Although I don't see it happening, I see nothing wrong with the concept. The only question I might have is: what sort of government?


"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

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sweetmiracle
Skeptic Friend

USA
74 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  11:06:37   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sweetmiracle a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

Way back in the late 1940's, I had a teacher who once said that given the speed of the day's transportation and communication, the entire world could be goverened fron a single point. I believed it then and still do; even more so, considering the advances made, especally in communication.

Although I don't see it happening, I see nothing wrong with the concept. The only question I might have is: what sort of government?





Another question would be...what if the government goes bad? What if such enormous power is concentrated in the hands of the few, and they become corrupt? They would have all the resources, and resistance just might be futile...

Remarkable claims require remarkable proof.

-Carl Sagan
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  11:09:26   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message
I think perhaps it frightens many because many end of the world senerios start with the one world gov.

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini
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bloody_peasant
Skeptic Friend

USA
139 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  11:27:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send bloody_peasant a Yahoo! Message Send bloody_peasant a Private Message
quote:
I think perhaps it frightens many because many end of the world senerios start with the one world gov.

Actually it makes at least some Christian fundamentalist ecstatic or at least it shoud as it fortells the soon to be rapture which they are waiting for with great anticipation. This is the some reason that these same fundamentalist back Israel and actually call for genocide of the Palestinians because supposidly Israel must be fully re-occupied by the Jews before the OWG forms and the rapture comes.

Actually you think those in the far religious right would be hoping to try and push a long the OWG like they are pushing for full occupation of Israel by the Jews. However maybe their are waiting for the right sequence of events first?

Let's see first Israel reclaims all of its original "homeland" as if such a "homeland" actually ever existed. Then Israel is besieged on all sides by enemies and war erupts. Then finally a new leader, the anti-christ appears, creates peace and forms the OWG. So I guess they can't promote the OWG until Israel reclaims all of its homeland, then they will promote war against Israel, finally they will promote OWG. Oh the humanity, all for their Biblical fantasy :<.
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  12:32:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
American egocentrism is the main reason people on the right here object to one world government. There is always lots of rhetoric about not wanting to be subject to the world court and not having soldiers under the command of the UN, among other indicators. Hey they're ahead of the third world. Why share?

The people on the left like the ones that objected to the WTO think a world government will be run by corporate interests that only answer to the bottom line and would exploit the masses' labor to the brink of slavery.
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard

USA
5310 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  12:37:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Gorgo a Private Message
I have no problem with a one-world government. In fact, the older I get, I'm not so sure why everybody's so danged het up on this here democracy nonsense. Sometimes I wonder if a benevolent dictator wouldn't be better than this. Or at least better than the fake partial democracy that we have in the U.S.

I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter



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woolytoad
Skeptic Friend

313 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  16:11:29   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send woolytoad a Private Message
quote:
I have no problem with a one-world government. In fact, the older I get, I'm not so sure why everybody's so danged het up on this here democracy nonsense. Sometimes I wonder if a benevolent dictator wouldn't be better than this. Or at least better than the fake partial democracy that we have in the U.S.


Well, as with most things, I think the problem is implementation. How do we make sure that the government stays honest? Of course we still have this problem now, but at least the entire world isn't under the control of a single government.
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sweetmiracle
Skeptic Friend

USA
74 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  16:38:45   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sweetmiracle a Private Message
quote:

Well, as with most things, I think the problem is implementation. How do we make sure that the government stays honest? Of course we still have this problem now, but at least the entire world isn't under the control of a single government.



Exactly. Especially since the current contender for World Governor allows countries like Sudan (which practices slavery) on the Human Rights Council....

It's bad enough to have super-countries like the US, where local issues are decided by people who live far away and have no grasp of the real issues. Large countries discourage individual participation in government while increasing the influence of mega-entities like corporations, unions, and other special-interest groups.

It would probably be a bit like the rights of individual states in the US.... they used to exist, but they really are pretty minimal at this point. Even if they are there on paper, the Fed just refuses funding if the states don't comply with the Great Nanny of Washington.

Also, we all know that it would be just another entity to pay even more taxes to.

Remarkable claims require remarkable proof.

-Carl Sagan
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Starman
SFN Regular

Sweden
1613 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2005 :  23:45:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Starman a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Gorgo

Sometimes I wonder if a benevolent dictator wouldn't be better than this. Or at least better than the fake partial democracy that we have in the U.S.
The problem is that no system with human dictators would stay benevolent.
Democracy in all its variants has its shortcomings, but the possibility for the people to get rid of its leaders without violence is very valuable.


"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones
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chaloobi
SFN Regular

1620 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2005 :  06:30:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send chaloobi a Yahoo! Message Send chaloobi a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by furshur

I was talking to a christian friend of mine and he started talking about the 'New World Order', so I asked him what that meant to him. He told me that it is one world goverment. I rather horrified him by saying I thought it is a great idea.
What would be wrong with one goverment? I realize a world goverment would not to eliminate all of the problems, and terrorism would probably be a bigger problem than it is now.
But one goverment would GREATLY decrease the chance of us blowing ourselves up in a nuclear war. I would imagine that not pouring trillions of dollars into defense could only have a positive effect on the economy.
I am not saying it will ever happen, but what would be wrong with a central world goverment?

There could be lots of problems. It all depends on the structure of the government, who was in charge, and how much power they had. If it was majority rule, then the Chinese and Indians would have a great deal of power and considering the cultural differences, that might not be so good for us Westerners. It might also degenerate into voting blocks based on religion - so the major opposing blocks would be Christian, Islamic and whatever they have in Asia. Again, I being agnostic don't really give a shit about religion.

But if there was a lot of autonomy for individual states/regions and the emphasis was on cultural freedom, it probably wouldn't be such a bad idea. I think the same result, military stability, can be achieved by merging economies, which is what globalization is all about. If economic law is pretty much uniform throughout the globe, you effectively have a single nation with regions of broad autonomy. Same thing as world government, I think.

-Chaloobi

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chaloobi
SFN Regular

1620 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2005 :  06:31:56   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send chaloobi a Yahoo! Message Send chaloobi a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf

I think perhaps it frightens many because many end of the world senerios start with the one world gov.

But those scenarios are all hogwash.

-Chaloobi

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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard

USA
5310 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2005 :  07:07:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Gorgo a Private Message
Unfortunately, (or fortunately) democracy and all its variants has yet to be tried.

quote:
Democracy in all its variants has its shortcomings, but the possibility for the people to get rid of its leaders without violence is very valuable.




I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter



Edited by - Gorgo on 04/14/2005 07:07:42
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Starman
SFN Regular

Sweden
1613 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2005 :  07:15:53   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Starman a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Gorgo

Unfortunately, (or fortunately) democracy and all its variants has yet to be tried.
Yea, and when someone claims to have a (or the) new, improved, true or perfect one we better be careful...
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard

USA
5310 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2005 :  07:25:02   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Gorgo a Private Message
Improved, maybe. Perfect no.

quote:
Yea, and when someone claims to have a (or the) new, improved, true or perfect one we better be careful...


I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter



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