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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  14:55:25  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
If it is possible for people in the world with power and money to get away with bad things, then why is everything that portrays a group of people doing something bad, and trying to get away, like all criminals do, always lumped into the conspiracy category, when we know these people are going to do WHATEVER to keep it secret, and they are not going to just turn themselves in? Are governments perfect? Are they capable of corruption?

How about the us government? Or is it that all good people come from america, and they are not capable of the atrocities that other leaders commit in other countries?But they are just humans too.If this is so, why is everything deemed a conspiracy? Is it a psychological defense mechanism so that we can block it out, and act as if it does not exist? It would be easier to do that rather than to try and change things. Any thoughts?

Edited by - HYBRID on 07/12/2005 14:58:06

Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  15:38:31   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

If it is possible for people in the world with power and money to get away with bad things, then why is everything that portrays a group of people doing something bad, and trying to get away, like all criminals do, always lumped into the conspiracy category, when we know these people are going to do WHATEVER to keep it secret, and they are not going to just turn themselves in? Are governments perfect? Are they capable of corruption?

How about the us government? Or is it that all good people come from america, and they are not capable of the atrocities that other leaders commit in other countries?But they are just humans too.If this is so, why is everything deemed a conspiracy? Is it a psychological defense mechanism so that we can block it out, and act as if it does not exist? It would be easier to do that rather than to try and change things. Any thoughts?


I think you're taking things to extremes.

Governments are corrupt. Heck, mine is. They conspire all the time to steal our precious money and hide their thefts from us. Only, sooner or later they get caught - just last week another case of corruption burst over. Yawn.

Now, governments can and do launder money, they can and do have top-secret military plants, they can and do have their own secret agendas. That's ok.

However, when the claim about the government's power is outrageous bordering on the ridiculous, such as controlling 100% of information and 100% of the media and hiding evidence for whole theories and things like that, it turns into a conspiracy theory (and, in my view, severe paranoia) when it bounces off the limits of the reasonable and into what's convenient to support one's own unsupported beliefs and need to believe in the intangible.

My opinion, anyway.

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard

USA
4907 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  16:34:36   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Ricky an AOL message Send Ricky a Private Message
quote:
If it is possible for people in the world with power and money to get away with bad things, then why is everything that portrays a group of people doing something bad, and trying to get away, like all criminals do, always lumped into the conspiracy category, when we know these people are going to do WHATEVER to keep it secret, and they are not going to just turn themselves in? Are governments perfect? Are they capable of corruption?


HYBRID, the goverment does bad things, yes. We have seen this in history and we can see it today. It only gets called conspiracy theory when you claim the government is doing something, but have no or little evidence to back up such a claim.

quote:
How about the us government? Or is it that all good people come from america, and they are not capable of the atrocities that other leaders commit in other countries?But they are just humans too.If this is so, why is everything deemed a conspiracy? Is it a psychological defense mechanism so that we can block it out, and act as if it does not exist? It would be easier to do that rather than to try and change things. Any thoughts?


Who thinks the US government doesn't have some level of corruption? Certainly not I.

Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  17:22:06   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Siberia

quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

If it is possible for people in the world with power and money to get away with bad things, then why is everything that portrays a group of people doing something bad, and trying to get away, like all criminals do, always lumped into the conspiracy category, when we know these people are going to do WHATEVER to keep it secret, and they are not going to just turn themselves in? Are governments perfect? Are they capable of corruption?

How about the us government? Or is it that all good people come from america, and they are not capable of the atrocities that other leaders commit in other countries?But they are just humans too.If this is so, why is everything deemed a conspiracy? Is it a psychological defense mechanism so that we can block it out, and act as if it does not exist? It would be easier to do that rather than to try and change things. Any thoughts?


I think you're taking things to extremes.

Governments are corrupt. Heck, mine is. They conspire all the time to steal our precious money and hide their thefts from us. Only, sooner or later they get caught - just last week another case of corruption burst over. Yawn.

Now, governments can and do launder money, they can and do have top-secret military plants, they can and do have their own secret agendas. That's ok.

However, when the claim about the government's power is outrageous bordering on the ridiculous, such as controlling 100% of information and 100% of the media and hiding evidence for whole theories and things like that, it turns into a conspiracy theory (and, in my view, severe paranoia) when it bounces off the limits of the reasonable and into what's convenient to support one's own unsupported beliefs and need to believe in the intangible.

My opinion, anyway.





Did not say they controlled it 100%. But they could, and what could you do about it? Could you stop the corruption that you know already exists? No, probably not. What is your point? The media is controlled by a very few, five companies, a fact. Now what?
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  17:24:52   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Ricky

quote:
If it is possible for people in the world with power and money to get away with bad things, then why is everything that portrays a group of people doing something bad, and trying to get away, like all criminals do, always lumped into the conspiracy category, when we know these people are going to do WHATEVER to keep it secret, and they are not going to just turn themselves in? Are governments perfect? Are they capable of corruption?


HYBRID, the goverment does bad things, yes. We have seen this in history and we can see it today. It only gets called conspiracy theory when you claim the government is doing something, but have no or little evidence to back up such a claim.

quote:
How about the us government? Or is it that all good people come from america, and they are not capable of the atrocities that other leaders commit in other countries?But they are just humans too.If this is so, why is everything deemed a conspiracy? Is it a psychological defense mechanism so that we can block it out, and act as if it does not exist? It would be easier to do that rather than to try and change things. Any thoughts?


Who thinks the US government doesn't have some level of corruption? Certainly not I.




SO if the government, who runs a country, or certain powers within it, did some corrupt things, and did not want you to know, how would you know? Because the government is definitely going to fess up to what they have done, right? And they are going to let you expose them on media that they own?Wake up!
Edited by - HYBRID on 07/12/2005 17:27:06
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Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  17:39:51   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message
quote:
The media is controlled by a very few, five companies, a fact.


Companies that are in viscious and very cut-throat competition with one another.

The idea that they are all secretly working together, and that the (literally) hundreds of thousands of people they employ are all "in" on it, is a major delusion. Even the idea that the CEO's are all in on something together is whacked, because they compete against one another.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  17:45:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Dude

quote:
The media is controlled by a very few, five companies, a fact.


Companies that are in viscious and very cut-throat competition with one another.


Just like Osama Bin Laden and his brothers who do business with the Bushes and America, right? Any other Cnn/fox news lines you want to run past me?

The idea that they are all secretly working together, and that the (literally) hundreds of thousands of people they employ are all "in" on it, is a major delusion. Even the idea that the CEO's are all in on something together is whacked, because they compete against one another.

Its not really secret. Your reality says they don't work together. Mine and many others in the media think otherwise.

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Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:02:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

quote:
Originally posted by Dude

quote:
The media is controlled by a very few, five companies, a fact.


Companies that are in viscious and very cut-throat competition with one another.


Just like Osama Bin Laden and his brothers who do business with the Bushes and America, right? Any other Cnn/fox news lines you want to run past me?

The idea that they are all secretly working together, and that the (literally) hundreds of thousands of people they employ are all "in" on it, is a major delusion. Even the idea that the CEO's are all in on something together is whacked, because they compete against one another.

Its not really secret. Your reality says they don't work together. Mine and many others in the media think otherwise.




Which doesn't make you right. The point is...?

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:08:41   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
Posting websites back and forth will not do anything, if we have no common meeting ground.
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:28:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message
Just wondering: when to the illuminati/Masons come into the discussion? I'm out of town and thus have limited internet access for the next few days and I won't want to miss it when verlch, er, someone brings that up...
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:40:44   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
So what you are saying is that the illuminati do not exist?
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Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:41:41   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

Posting websites back and forth will not do anything, if we have no common meeting ground.


Indeed. So, what's your point? Tell us what goes in that pretty head of yours, bro.

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:49:09   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
If it is indeed true that people can have a malevolent intent, and that it may be possible for them to move about, and shape ultimately the course of the world without being exposed, by the massess as a whole and not just a few, then a lot of things may be possible. I am actually tring to go somewhere with this, it just depends on the guy with the nice sumerian writing name says next, and also how you respond.
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HYBRID
BANNED

USA
344 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:51:22   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HYBRID a Private Message
Is it also possible for some of the most famous people in the world really be the most deviant covertly? If think not, then I should stop right.
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Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  18:56:25   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

If it is indeed true that people can have a malevolent intent, and that it may be possible for them to move about, and shape ultimately the course of the world without being exposed, by the massess as a whole and not just a few, then a lot of things may be possible. I am actually tring to go somewhere with this, it just depends on the guy with the nice sumerian writing name says next, and also how you respond.


Yes, it is. I wouldn't say 'malevolent', though. That's too conspiracy theory like. I'd say "to their own interests" - mostly financial.

But it is also dead hard to keep masses (and I'm not talking about a handful of military people - I'm talking about thousands, if not millions of people) with their mouths tightly shut. Hell, it's hard even to keep a company's employees with their mouths shut! I had to sign an incredible amount of stuff just to keep my job's affairs secret (I work with Market Intelligence - intelligence as the intelligence in CIA, only to a much lesser, lighter degree) and I have no doubt leakage still occurs, if not from me, from somebody else.

And yes, the Illuminati did exist. A long time ago. Weren't they extinguished? My history fails me now.

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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tw101356
Skeptic Friend

USA
333 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2005 :  19:02:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send tw101356 a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HYBRID

So what you are saying is that the illuminati do not exist?



Actually the Illuminati do exist, but they're merely a red herring thrown up by the lizard people who themselves are a false front created by the Mafia. The Mafia, in turn, is really a Jesuit run organization, but the Jesuits actually answer to the Bilderberg Group, which is, of course, the public face of the Trilateral Commission. The heads of the Trilateral Commission are the puppets of the Masons, who are the front organization that masks the nefarious plots of the AAA. Triple A is but one arm of the Illuminati.

- TW
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