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llDayo
New Member
USA
24 Posts |
 Posted - 10/05/2005 : 11:21:33 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by SiberiaSadly, that's a common behavior for said thread-starter.
I'll have to look for more then. |
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breakballs
Sockpuppet
53 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 03:21:06 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by ktesibios
markie, you've implied that you also think that WTC 1 & 2 were demolished by explosives. If I'm correct in inferring this, you really need to have a look at the NIST draft report Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers (Draft). In particular, see the photos which are included as figure 6-6 on page 241 of the pdf file, and figures 6-17 through 6-21 on pages 255 through 258. You can see the exterior columns of both buildings buckling under the abnormal loads imposed by the impact damage and the fires just before each building collapsed. There's no need to invoke putative bombs to explain the collapses- the incipient structural failure is visible to the naked eye.
If you go through the entire report you'll see a remarkable effort at reconstructing a disaster made by people who took considerable pains to validate their models against reality, by experiment where possible, else by checking the predictions made at each step against what could be determined from the photographic and other physical evidence. In the end, their predictions of what probably happened tallied rather closely with what was actually observed.
Looking at how many different scientific and engineering disciplines were involved in studying the WTC towers' destruction, you might also realize that for predicting the behavior of large and complex structures under conditions of extreme abuse "common sense" and conspiracy-mongers' appeals to it are useless. If you wouldn't rely on common sense to know how to design those buildings, you can't rely on it to understand how they fail.
No steel skyscraper can crash that way, a more or less large portion of the Towers would have had to stand up. |
THE BEST HELICOPTER PILOT IN THE WORLD |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 04:03:55 [Permalink]
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quote:
No steel skyscraper can crash that way, a more or less large portion of the Towers would have had to stand up.
References please...
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 04:50:37 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
References please...
Don't hold your breath.
He neither have the brain nor the balls to provide that... |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 05:23:06 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Starman
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
References please...
Don't hold your breath.
He neither have the brain nor the balls to provide that...
Yeah, I know. But if this sad turkey of a thread must be resurrected, I'd as soon as it were bbbb. He is much less vile than it's originator.
And hey, he's out and about. He's actually joined a thread that's not his own! Might be there's hope for him yet... 
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 07:19:43 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by breakballs
quote:
Originally posted by ktesibios
markie, you've implied that you also think that WTC 1 & 2 were demolished by explosives. If I'm correct in inferring this, you really need to have a look at the NIST draft report Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers (Draft). In particular, see the photos which are included as figure 6-6 on page 241 of the pdf file, and figures 6-17 through 6-21 on pages 255 through 258. You can see the exterior columns of both buildings buckling under the abnormal loads imposed by the impact damage and the fires just before each building collapsed. There's no need to invoke putative bombs to explain the collapses- the incipient structural failure is visible to the naked eye.
If you go through the entire report you'll see a remarkable effort at reconstructing a disaster made by people who took considerable pains to validate their models against reality, by experiment where possible, else by checking the predictions made at each step against what could be determined from the photographic and other physical evidence. In the end, their predictions of what probably happened tallied rather closely with what was actually observed.
Looking at how many different scientific and engineering disciplines were involved in studying the WTC towers' destruction, you might also realize that for predicting the behavior of large and complex structures under conditions of extreme abuse "common sense" and conspiracy-mongers' appeals to it are useless. If you wouldn't rely on common sense to know how to design those buildings, you can't rely on it to understand how they fail.
No steel skyscraper can crash that way, a more or less large portion of the Towers would have had to stand up.
Engineering experts disagree with you. Prove your assertion that they are wrong. Remember, links have been placed in this thread which clearly outline the tensile strength of steel and how it degrades when heated vastly by uncontrolled fire. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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breakballs
Sockpuppet
53 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 09:52:10 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Engineering experts disagree with you. Prove your assertion that they are wrong. Remember, links have been placed in this thread which clearly outline the tensile strength of steel and how it degrades when heated vastly by uncontrolled fire.
Uncontrolled fire was at the top of Towers but structures at the bottom were undamaged and a more or less large portion of them would have had to stand up.
Your engineers are very stupid. Not even with bombs you can rase to the ground two powerful skyscrapers like those. |
THE BEST HELICOPTER PILOT IN THE WORLD |
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 10:00:26 [Permalink]
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| Yeah? Who the hell are you? Show your credentials and your detailed analysis. Otherwise, stfu. |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 10:02:18 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by breakballs
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Engineering experts disagree with you. Prove your assertion that they are wrong. Remember, links have been placed in this thread which clearly outline the tensile strength of steel and how it degrades when heated vastly by uncontrolled fire.
Uncontrolled fire was at the top of Towers but structures at the bottom were undamaged and a more or less large portion of them would have had to stand up.
Your engineers are very stupid. Not even with bombs you can rase to the ground two powerful skyscrapers like those.
The manner of destruction of the towers was discussed here as well as the structural weight that came raining down and caused the rest to fail. It happens every time a trained demolition expert takes down a building with explosives. By breaking the structural members, the weight of the structure destroys it.
The "I know better than everyone and don't have to provide evidence" thing is old, bigbrain sockpuppet. Provide evidence of your assertations. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2005 : 11:05:02 [Permalink]
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quote:
Sockpuppet:
Your engineers are very stupid.
Thank you for this detailed analysis of the failure of the engineer's detailed analysis of what happened. You are indeed a critical thinker without peer…
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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breakballs
Sockpuppet
53 Posts |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2005 : 12:08:49 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by breakballs
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
If I'm correct in inferring this, you really need to have a look at the NIST draft report Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers (Draft).
458 pages. Your engineers are not only stupid but verbose too.
Instead of acting smug, why don't you prove it with real sources and not what you try to pass off as intellect, bigbrain?
Every time you post a lie, Da Vinci cries in Heaven. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
| Edited by - Valiant Dancer on 10/14/2005 12:09:27 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2005 : 12:22:17 [Permalink]
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I have had considerable training in demolitions, as had every Navy diver of my era, and I assure you that a good demolution team could drop thoes towers into their cellar holes with ease.
To add my voice to the dischordant harmony, go back and read through the thread. If you do this, you will find all of the information you need on how the towers collapsed and why. As much as I'd like to blame it on a Bush conspiricy, the evidence ain't there. Probably because Karl Rove didn't think of it....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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breakballs
Sockpuppet
53 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2005 : 06:44:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
I have had considerable training in demolitions, as had every
But you have never seen a powerful steel skyscraper crashing this way.
A more or less large portion of the two Towers would have had to stand up.
Notice some pictures about burned buildings or buildings hit with bombs.
A more or less large portion of the two Towers would have had to stand up. |
THE BEST HELICOPTER PILOT IN THE WORLD |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2005 : 07:35:39 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by breakballs
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
I have had considerable training in demolitions, as had every
But you have never seen a powerful steel skyscraper crashing this way.
A more or less large portion of the two Towers would have had to stand up.
Notice some pictures about burned buildings or buildings hit with bombs.
A more or less large portion of the two Towers would have had to stand up.
Ah, I see that bbbb is reverting to form -- can't talk without screaming, and 'tis only a matter of time before he goes into vivid color.
As I said before, go back through this thread, studiously, and all will be made clear.
But just for the masochistic hell of it, what are your thoughts as to what happened to the towers? Do be precise and detailed, and provide reference.
By the bye, I've heard that that an elective surgery clinic in Mexico is having a special on lobotomies next week. You might want to look into that....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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