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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
 Posted - 01/04/2006 : 13:02:05 [Permalink]
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quote:
In general, bad things happening to people are not direct, supernatural punishments, but are simply natural or man-made occurences which unrepentant people are not protected from.
Obviously it is impossible to have a rational conversation with a delusional person.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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GeeMack
SFN Regular
USA
1093 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 13:25:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by hippy4christ...
In general, bad things happening to people are not direct, supernatural punishments, but are simply natural or man-made occurences which unrepentant people are not protected from.
Evidence? And please include references. Again, as always, your delusion of your imaginary friend and your belief in the allegories in your book of myths do not constitute evidence. Oh, no evidence again? 
I feel sorry for people like you who live in that constant state of debilitating guilt. If you look into it I'm sure you can get some help for that problem.
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GeeMack
SFN Regular
USA
1093 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 13:33:10 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by hippy4christ...
I wouldn't be surprised if it was punishment, but what is more likely is that the explosion wasn't so much punishment as it was a lack of protection. For instance:
Luk 13:4-5 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
In fact, let's take this a step further. You go out there to West Virginia and you tell the friends and relatives of those dead miners just what you think. You tell them about the kind of judgment you have passed on their deceased loved ones. You'd be lucky to escape with your life. But you wouldn't dare, because you're a pussy. You talk here like you're some kind of protected angel, or like you have some divine insight about good and evil and your god's means and motives for inflicting punishment, but you don't have the balls to go tell those people in West Virginia that you have deemed their dead miners to be sinners. You're disgusting.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 13:45:23 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by hippy4christ
In general, bad things happening to people are not direct, supernatural punishments, but are simply natural or man-made occurences which unrepentant people are not protected from.
Why? Wouldn't the truly faithful and repentant happily welcome a short stay here on Earth, and everlasting life in Heaven? Why would God lengthen the mortal lives of those who have the proper amount of faith? Extra life down here in the mud is not the reward promised to believers.quote:
The accident was sad...
Why? Is there some Commandment I'm not aware of which says "Thou shalt not die in an accident?" Do you have any evidence that any of the 12 dead people went to hell? Don't trials like this bring out the true colors of the alleged faithful left behind, strengthening the truly faithful's ties with God? Isn't that a good thing? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard
USA
3834 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 14:33:41 [Permalink]
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Hey, I don't want to make light of the tragedy here but Wow, Praise the Lord....whoops!
There was one guy that really gave a fascinating interview and I wonder if Robertson will exploit it. The man said when they were in the church and were told there was one death the pastor called for everyone to pray for that family. The man said only 3 people and himself started praying and everyone else was all caught up in their personal good fortune. It was so poignant. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 15:34:13 [Permalink]
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I saw an interview in Swedish TV with some of the relatives to those lost in the accident.
Aparently they were very upset about the miscommunication giving them false hope. One woman said they would "sue the company for lying to them"[sic].
Is this symptomatic for the general public? If someone screws up and miscommunicate something, and suddenly people feel it warranted to bring up law-suits? |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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GeeMack
SFN Regular
USA
1093 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 15:48:59 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse...
Is this symptomatic for the general public? If someone screws up and miscommunicate something, and suddenly people feel it warranted to bring up law-suits?
Yes.
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 16:20:13 [Permalink]
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The US legal system is bizarre.... to say the least.
I'm sure that the "miscommunication" will, at a minimum, factor into the damages the families of the dead miners will get when they sue the mine.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 18:08:13 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
Is this symptomatic for the general public? If someone screws up and miscommunicate something, and suddenly people feel it warranted to bring up law-suits?
It's called undue emotional distress. I don't know, I mean what if your girlfriend's doctor called you in and said that she had three months to live, and then right as you broke down in tears he said "Ah, just kidding with ya!" That sort head game might be something you'd want to sue over.
Personally, I think in a situation as tense and tenuous as this, the Gov. and mining officials had no right to allow this sort of rumor to spread unchecked. It was their responsibility to control the flow of information and quelch any untruths before they snowballed. You don't let families go several hours under the impression that their loved ones had been rescued. That's just inexcusable.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 18:28:39 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by beskeptigal
There was one guy that really gave a fascinating interview and I wonder if Robertson will exploit it. The man said when they were in the church and were told there was one death the pastor called for everyone to pray for that family. The man said only 3 people and himself started praying and everyone else was all caught up in their personal good fortune. It was so poignant.
That was the same guy that I heard. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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spacecadet
New Member
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 19:40:25 [Permalink]
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On a personal note, do you know what really saddens and sickens me about this entire ( 2 page) thread that I just got through reading?
Instead of having any sense of pity or pathos or simply having the common decency to respect the loss of other people's loved ones in such a tragic event, you people have quite rudely and disrespectfully chosen this event to continue your personal vendetta for or against the existence of God.
In the 50's people would have sent flowers and cards of condolensce.
Here it is the year 2006 and we have rudely and callously drug up such a discussion as this with no regard for the loss or pain of the families.
Sela'
There is a 100% chance that you wont get out of here alive, whether you are a believer or not.
Show the dead and their families some dignity.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 20:03:56 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by spacecadet
Show the dead and their families some dignity.
The idea that this thread consists of the whole of our thoughts on this matter is, to put it simply, idiotic.
You have no clue as to what I or anyone else may have done to show respect for those poor folks (victims all), and nobody has any obligation here (or anywhere else, for that matter) to wear their heart on their sleeve just so that spacecadet knows who is treating them with dignity and who isn't.
Your arrogance is astounding in light of the humility you're asking others to display for you. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2006 : 00:01:14 [Permalink]
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Look what those gay marrying liberals made God do now:
Sharon fights for life after stroke
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
What a load of bullshit.
Sums it up nicely.
And spacecadet, you get my vote for the "Pompous Blowhard of the Month" award.
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"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones |
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moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2006 : 05:44:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
quote:
Originally posted by hippy4christ
In general, bad things happening to people are not direct, supernatural punishments, but are simply natural or man-made occurences which unrepentant people are not protected from.
Why? Wouldn't the truly faithful and repentant happily welcome a short stay here on Earth, and everlasting life in Heaven? Why would God lengthen the mortal lives of those who have the proper amount of faith? Extra life down here in the mud is not the reward promised to believers.
I recall a Billy Graham column answering a question concerning a friends belief in reincarnation. Within the first paragraph of the reply was, "Why would anyone want to endure the pain and suffering of this life again."
I agree with Dave, a shorter stay on Earth for the faithful should be welcomed. |
Life is good
Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2006 : 06:43:33 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by spacecadet
On a personal note, do you know what really saddens and sickens me about this entire ( 2 page) thread that I just got through reading?
Instead of having any sense of pity or pathos or simply having the common decency to respect the loss of other people's loved ones in such a tragic event, you people have quite rudely and disrespectfully chosen this event to continue your personal vendetta for or against the existence of God.
In the 50's people would have sent flowers and cards of condolensce.
Here it is the year 2006 and we have rudely and callously drug up such a discussion as this with no regard for the loss or pain of the families.
Sela'
There is a 100% chance that you wont get out of here alive, whether you are a believer or not.
Show the dead and their families some dignity.
What thread did you read?
This thread was mindful of the dead and merely pointed out the common attitude by the religiously extreme. One backed up by the posting of Hippy and the vehement responses following. It also shows respect for the dead that we decided to ridicule religious leaders who seize upon the opportunity of natural disaster or accidents to pontificate about how this "wouldn't have happened if the people/nation was right with God".
Evidentially somewhere north of the bottom of the first page, you stopped reading. No fewer than four people jumped on Hippy for his "the dead didn't have enough faith" comment.
I am also unaware of any forum rule or stricture that says we must at all times make spacecadet fully aware of what we have or have not done to respect the dead in accidents and natural disasters. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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