Skeptic Friends Network

Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?
Home | Forums | Active Topics | Active Polls | Register | FAQ | Contact Us  
  Connect: Chat | SFN Messenger | Buddy List | Members
Personalize: Profile | My Page | Forum Bookmarks  
 All Forums
 Our Skeptic Forums
 Politics
 NAMBLA and the good ol ACLU
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 5

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  07:14:58  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
Moderator: copyrighted material deleted. Full text can be found here.

http://www.operationlookout.org/lookoutmag/aclu_to_defend_nambla.htm

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-


Edited by - Valiant Dancer on 02/01/2006 21:55:14

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  07:48:04   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
Hm, couldn't open the link. File not found.

It appears to me, and correct me if I'm wrong, that the ACLU has nothing to do with the murder and molestation cases; rather they are defending NAMBLA's right to keep their membership list confidential. While I think NAMBLA is disgusting, as long as they are not breaking the law, they are perfectly free under the Constitution to have anonymity. The two assholes convicted can swing in the wind as far as I'm concerned. Hell, I'll provide the rope and tie the knots.

The ACLU has a history of defending the rights of loathsome people; they tried to keep Rush Limbaugh's medical records out of the hands of the proscecution in his dope fiend charges.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie

USA
4826 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  07:49:44   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Valiant Dancer's Homepage Send Valiant Dancer a Private Message
Damn shame you can't point to anything more recent than 2000 for your objection.

We don't dispute that the ACLU has not backed the wrong horse. But the defense of free speech does not equate to the ACLU agreeing with or supporting the individual organization's views. It is strictly on the merits of the case. I think they were going for the right of free association. It was the wrong case, IMHO, for them to take.

Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils

Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion
Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  07:59:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer

Damn shame you can't point to anything more recent than 2000 for your objection.




Moderator: copyrighted material deleted. Full text of article can be seen here


http://gribbit.blogspot.com/2005/12/aclu-challenges-49ers-pat-down-policy.html

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Edited by - Valiant Dancer on 02/01/2006 21:53:42
Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:07:08   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

The two assholes convicted can swing in the wind as far as I'm concerned. Hell, I'll provide the rope and tie the knots.





Yeah, and who are you to force your will and beliefs on these two that homo child rape is wrong? Just because you say that it is wrong good for you. The ACLU will say you have no right to force your beliefs on child pervs. You just have a biggoted homo-child perv world view is how the ACLU would spin it in court. And then some activist loon judge will hand out a slap on the wrist. Then the ACLU and their fundies will give each other high fives (in the name of "freedom") as the homo child pervs walk. Just great!

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Go to Top of Page

moakley
SFN Regular

USA
1886 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:20:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send moakley a Private Message
What's your point? The scum who killed the boy have both been tried and convicted. As far as the crime itself and the web site is concerned you can show correlation, but can you prove causation. The scum would have likely commited this heinous crime regardless of the web site. As an example of extremist thinking, can you show that this type of crime never occurred prior to the internet.

As far as the ACLU is concerned this is a free speech issue. It's free speech on a topic I have contempt for, but free speech never the less.

Where would you draw the line in the sensoring of ideas and (in your case) knowledge? You do have a history here.

btw. The link didn't work.

Life is good

Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous
Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:20:30   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

Hm, couldn't open the link. File not found.

It appears to me, and correct me if I'm wrong, that the ACLU has nothing to do with the murder and molestation cases; rather they are defending NAMBLA's right to keep their membership list confidential.


THEY ARE DEFENDING THE BASTARDS THAT BUT A BOY IN CONCRETE BECAUSE HE WOULD NOT HAVE SEX WITH THEM! THEY DEFEND THE OTHER BASTARDS THAT VISIT THE SAME MAN AND BOY SEX SITE AS THESE CHILD KILLERS DID. MANY OF THESE BASTARDS HAVE ALREADY BEEN CONVIVTED OF CHILD RAPE IN PREVIOUS CASES. THE ACLU DEFENDS THESE BASTARDS UNDER THE GUISE OF THE FIRST AMENDMENT. THE ACLU LAWERS SHOULD HANG WITH THE CHILD RAPERS/KILLERS AND THE PARENTS OF ALL THE KIDS THAT HAVE BEEN AFFECTED BY ANONYMOUS VISITORS TO THE MAN AND BOY SEX SITE GET TO PULL THE NOOSE!!!!! HAS OUR COUNTRY LOST IT'S WAY TO THE POINT WHERE CHILD RAPE IS PROUDLY DEFENDED IN THE COURTS? IF SO THEN GOD HELP US ALL.

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Go to Top of Page

GeeMack
SFN Regular

USA
1093 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:41:12   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send GeeMack a Private Message
Top posting was plagiarized from an Associated Press item which was posted all over the net nearly six years ago, in August 2000. Here is one link among at least 300... The American Civil Liberties Union. It carries a notice, " 2000 The Associated Press".

Second posting was plagiarized from an op-ed piece on Republican Voices in December of '05.
Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:44:28   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott

quote:
Originally posted by filthy

The two assholes convicted can swing in the wind as far as I'm concerned. Hell, I'll provide the rope and tie the knots.





Yeah, and who are you to force your will and beliefs on these two that homo child rape is wrong? Just because you say that it is wrong good for you. The ACLU will say you have no right to force your beliefs on child pervs. You just have a biggoted homo-child perv world view is how the ACLU would spin it in court. And then some activist loon judge will hand out a slap on the wrist. Then the ACLU and their fundies will give each other high fives (in the name of "freedom") as the homo child pervs walk. Just great!

As a card-carying member of the ACLU, I must ask: What the hell have you been smoking?

The ACLU is dedicated to defending the consitutional rights of all American citizens. That means you too, Bill, in the unhappy event it should come to that. As stated, I consider NAMBLA a vile organization, but any member innocent of acting out his fantasies has the same rights as any of the rest of us. Further, even when charged with a crime, the defendant has certain rights. This really pisses off some conservatives, and to them, I say, "Tough titty motherfuckers, the Constitution rules, so suck it up!"

Think about it, Bill -- what if you were charged, rightly or wrongly, with a crime and refused representation in court? What if you were suspected, rightly or wrongly, of associating with a terrorist and were incarcerated without charge and legal representation? Who is gonna speak for you?




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:49:29   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by moakley

What's your point? The scum who killed the boy have both been tried and convicted. As far as the crime itself and the web site is concerned you can show correlation, but can you prove causation. The scum would have likely commited this heinous crime regardless of the web site. As an example of extremist thinking, can you show that this type of crime never occurred prior to the internet.

As far as the ACLU is concerned this is a free speech issue. It's free speech on a topic I have contempt for, but free speech never the less.

Where would you draw the line in the sensoring of ideas and (in your case) knowledge? You do have a history here.

btw. The link didn't work.



What's your point? The scum who killed the boy have both been tried and convicted.

(bill) By defending the child pervs ability to hide behind curtains and remain in the shadows while viewing a catalog of young victims, opps I mean lovers the ACLU shows it's true stripes of supporting anti child, anti social, anti American, anti decent behavior. Besides the fact that man and boy sex is ILLEGAL!!!!! Why should those involved in illegal behavior deserve the right of being anonymous?



As far as the crime itself and the web site is concerned you can show correlation, but can you prove causation. The scum would have likely committed this heinous crime regardless of the web site.

(bill) Maybe, maybe not? It is much more likely that viewing this website stirred the lust in their heart that they have for little boys, which the piece said they were on the site previous to the murder. Man and boy sex is illegal so of coarse it's participants want to remain anonymous. Most people involved in illegal and disgusting activity long to be anonymous, only they don't get free representation from the ACLU like homo child pervs do. Just great!





As an example of extremist thinking, can you show that this type of crime never occurred prior to the internet.

(bill) This talk has nothing to do with the WWW but instead the ACLU's willingness to go to bat for homo child rapist and his desire to remain anonymous.



As far as the ACLU is concerned this is a free speech issue. It's free speech on a topic I have contempt for, but free speech never the less.

(bill) You and the ACLU can hide behind "free speech" all day long. At the end of the day the ACLU has defended child pervs who will and have raped, in many cases homo, more children and the ACLU pats itself on the back as a champion of freedom. (sigh) A champion for the freedom for homo child rapist that is. Just great!


Where would you draw the line in the sensoring of ideas and (in your case) knowledge?

(bill) To start with, when an activity like man/boy sex is highly illegal, that is a good place to draw the line.

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:53:04   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by GeeMack

Top posting was plagiarized from an Associated Press item which was posted all over the net nearly six years ago, in August 2000. Here is one link among at least 300... The American Civil Liberties Union. It carries a notice, " 2000 The Associated Press".

Second posting was plagiarized from an op-ed piece on Republican Voices in December of '05.




Were impressed. GeeMac can use google like the rest of us. If I was plagiarizing I would have removed the credits. Now go back and play with your blocks.

"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Go to Top of Page

pleco
SFN Addict

USA
2996 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  08:55:45   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit pleco's Homepage Send pleco a Private Message
So the ACLU defends a few groups you (and most of the rest of us) find digusting, so you are ready to throw out the entire organization, especially when they would just as willingly come to bat FOR YOU if you found your rights being trampled and needed help?

Maybe you shouldn't get so angry then when people crap on the entire body of christianity because a few extremists call themselves christians? They aren't really christians, though, right?

by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart.
Edited by - pleco on 02/01/2006 08:57:14
Go to Top of Page

Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  09:01:06   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message
quote:
The ACLU will say you have no right to force your beliefs on child pervs.


Your level of ignorance is nothing short of.... ok, well, it isn't so shocking. What is shocking is the fact that any American can be an enemy of free speech. You make me sick.

Or maybe you have just read a bunch of moronic extremist right-wing propoganda (as you so obviously have with your infantile objections to evolution) and don't have any actual idea of what the ACLU does.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
Go to Top of Page

GeeMack
SFN Regular

USA
1093 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  09:11:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send GeeMack a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Scott...

Were impressed. GeeMac can use google like the rest of us. If I was plagiarizing I would have removed the credits. Now go back and play with your blocks.
You may want to familiarize yourself with the Fair Use Provisions of the United States copyright laws. Unless you are able to verify that you have specific permission from the authors of the articles posted, what you have done is indeed plagiarism and is a violation of the law. But you haven't said a single thing in any of your postings yet that indicates you might understand such things (or much of anything rational at all), so it doesn't surprise me in the least that it got past you.
Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  09:14:05   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
I tnink that you're looking at this from the wrong angle. The ACLU is NOT defending these criminals, only their constitutional rights.

Consider: if those rights have been violated, they have a stronger case upon appeal even if as guilty as being caught in the act. On the other hand, if all proper, constitutional procedures and precautions have been meticulously carried out, and thay are indeed guilty, it's "Goodby Charie, you and yer buddy'r goin' away." As seems to have happened in this case, and properly so.

The internet is a mixed blessing. If these two degenerates hadn't found NAMBLA's crap, they'd have found it elsewhere because they were looking for it. How many busts have you read about where a cop in the guise of a 13 or 15 year old catches a paedophile after arranging a 'meeting?" And the ACLU is fine with that, as am I.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

Bill scott
SFN Addict

USA
2103 Posts

Posted - 02/01/2006 :  09:20:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Bill scott a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott

quote:
Originally posted by filthy

The two assholes convicted can swing in the wind as far as I'm concerned. Hell, I'll provide the rope and tie the knots.





Yeah, and who are you to force your will and beliefs on these two that homo child rape is wrong? Just because you say that it is wrong good for you. The ACLU will say you have no right to force your beliefs on child pervs. You just have a biggoted homo-child perv world view is how the ACLU would spin it in court. And then some activist loon judge will hand out a slap on the wrist. Then the ACLU and their fundies will give each other high fives (in the name of "freedom") as the homo child pervs walk. Just great!

As a card-carying member of the ACLU, I must ask: What the hell have you been smoking?

The ACLU is dedicated to defending the consitutional rights of all American citizens. That means you too, Bill, in the unhappy event it should come to that. As stated, I consider NAMBLA a vile organization, but any member innocent of acting out his fantasies has the same rights as any of the rest of us. Further, even when charged with a crime, the defendant has certain rights. This really pisses off some conservatives, and to them, I say, "Tough titty motherfuckers, the Constitution rules, so suck it up!"

Think about it, Bill -- what if you were charged, rightly or wrongly, with a crime and refused representation in court? What if you were suspected, rightly or wrongly, of associating with a terrorist and were incarcerated without charge and legal representation? Who is gonna speak for you?








As a card-carying member of the ACLU, I must ask: What the hell have you been smoking?
(bill) Whatever it is I am not afraid to get caught with it, the ACLU will defend might right to smoke uncontested. Well I might have to throw in a desire to remain anonymous for funding illegal man/boy sex activity on the web but then they will defend me. A weed smoking, child raping, child porn visiting scum, yeah what probable cause could the authorities have to want to know this guys name? Good job ACLU, way to keep us and all our kids safe in these dangerous days. (sigh)

The ACLU is dedicated to defending the consitutional rights of all American citizens.
(bill) However, for some reason, the prefer to represent homo child pervs.


That means you too, Bill, in the unhappy event it should come to that. As stated,
(bill) Well if I want to view child porn with nobody knowing I am sure they will be at my beck and call. And free of charge no less. Just great!


I consider NAMBLA a vile organization,
(bill)
I knew we held common ground on something.

but any member innocent of acting out his fantasies has the same rights as any of the rest of us.
(bill) Not if his fantasy includes the highly illegal activity of man/boy rape.

Further, even when charged with a crime, the defendant has certain rights.
(bill) Remaining anonymous after being involved in illegal boy/man sex activity of any kind should not be one of them

This really pisses off some conservatives, and to them, I say, "Tough titty motherfuckers, the Constitution rules, so suck it up!"
(bill) Wrong! What pisses us off are the fools who under the guise of freedom go to bat for homo child rape supporters and forget the kids on the other end who have been raped or raped and murdered by current and upstanding NAMBAL members. And they (ACLU) have a complete lack of remorse and actually sit around and feel good about themselves. Sick!


Think about it, Bill -- what if you were charged, rightly or wrongly, with a crime and refused representation in court? What if you were suspected, rightly or wrongly, of associating with a terrorist and were incarcerated without charge and legal representation? Who is gonna speak for you?
(bill) Better yet, think if I was rightly jailed for man/boy sex then who would defend me? The ACLU of coarse. They would at the bare minimum defend my right to remain anonymous. And believe me if you are in the tank and you know that your guilty of man/boy sex it is nice to know someone is still on your side and understand your plight. Sick!

I would not be to proud of that ACLU card. Your donations was used to defend homo child pervs. I guess the ACLU would argue that that is your right. Just great!


"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-

"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-

The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-

Go to Top of Page
Page: of 5 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Jump To:

The mission of the Skeptic Friends Network is to promote skepticism, critical thinking, science and logic as the best methods for evaluating all claims of fact, and we invite active participation by our members to create a skeptical community with a wide variety of viewpoints and expertise.


Home | Skeptic Forums | Skeptic Summary | The Kil Report | Creation/Evolution | Rationally Speaking | Skeptillaneous | About Skepticism | Fan Mail | Claims List | Calendar & Events | Skeptic Links | Book Reviews | Gift Shop | SFN on Facebook | Staff | Contact Us

Skeptic Friends Network
© 2008 Skeptic Friends Network Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 1.47 seconds.
Powered by @tomic Studio
Snitz Forums 2000