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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
 Posted - 03/13/2006 : 19:17:12
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I went to my first Free@VT (Freethinker) meeting tonight and one of the things that we were discussing at the end is what to discuss next time. We settled on two topics:
1. The history of the freethought movement
2. Terms for non-theists (atheist, agnostic, bright, etc) and their different meanings
Now everyone said that they didn't know much on these topics, myself included. So we agreed to each try to do a little research and see what we can come up with. So I was wondering if anyone had any good sources for either of these.
The different terms I know of are:
Bright, atheist, agnostic, noncognitist, atheist-agnostic, freethinker, and naturalist.
Can anyone add more?
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Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov |
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R.Wreck
SFN Regular
USA
1191 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2006 : 19:38:28 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Ricky
I went to my first Free@VT (Freethinker) meeting tonight and one of the things that we were discussing at the end is what to discuss next time. We settled on two topics:
1. The history of the freethought movement
2. Terms for non-theists (atheist, agnostic, bright, etc) and their different meanings
Now everyone said that they didn't know much on these topics, myself included. So we agreed to each try to do a little research and see what we can come up with. So I was wondering if anyone had any good sources for either of these.
The different terms I know of are:
Bright, atheist, agnostic, noncognitist, atheist-agnostic, freethinker, and naturalist.
Can anyone add more?
You'll probably find some good sources for historical information in the library over at Internet Infidels. |
The foundation of morality is to . . . give up pretending to believe that for which there is no evidence, and repeating unintelligible propositions about things beyond the possibliities of knowledge.
T. H. Huxley
The Cattle Prod of Enlightened Compassion
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2006 : 23:09:50 [Permalink]
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You forgot skeptic!
Rationalist is a good one too. Also pantheists and deists have been an important part of the history of the freethought movement. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2006 : 06:23:17 [Permalink]
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Apostate & Heretic. Infidel....
Luddite...? 
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2006 : 08:00:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Luddite...?
Aren't Luddites those who have a compulsive hatred for machines and technological progress? |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2006 : 08:13:14 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Siberia
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Luddite...?
Aren't Luddites those who have a compulsive hatred for machines and technological progress?
Exactly right!
Is that free-thought, or what? 
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 03:11:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Ricky
The different terms I know of are:
Bright, atheist, agnostic, noncognitist, atheist-agnostic, freethinker, and naturalist.
Can anyone add more?
We used to say 'open minded'. But from what some so called 'skeptics' post on this site, I don't think the terms are the same.
I used to think atheists were more open minded (willing to listen to ideas before judging) than the average person but what I've seen lately here and other places they are more bigoted than a lot of other groups. So I don't think you can use the word Freethinker and atheist in the same tone.
People who are open minded are in a group by themselves. Certainly they are not skeptics or agnostic and absolutly skeptics are not always bright.
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Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 03:36:44 [Permalink]
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Well help us reach your higher state of open-mindedness, oh enlightened one!
With my limited abilities you just sound like any other pompous hypocrite, willfully deaf to any argument that might challenge your preconceived notions.
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 05:15:52 [Permalink]
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It might have been Sagan -- it sounds like something he'd come up with -- who said this (paraphrasing):
"Be open-minded, but not so open that your brain falls out."
We all have our own stupid, little prejudices but I've found that as a rule, atheists seem to harbor fewer of them.
"Let he who is without disgusting, intestinal fauna fling the first faeces, eh?" 
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 06:01:00 [Permalink]
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quote:
People who are open minded are in a group by themselves. Certainly they are not skeptics or agnostic...
People who are "open minded" are not in a group by themselves. There is a continuum of "open mindedness" for lots of different things. Don't fall into the "tyranny of the discontinuous mind" trap by over-categorizing. Saying that, skeptics are certainly open minded - they have to be able to change their minds when new evidence is presented. Agnostics can be both open or closed minded - their minds are only closed to the existence of 19,999 gods as opposed to the normal 20,000. That's a difference of less than 0.005% which hardly merits mentioning. |
METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 10:13:20 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
It might have been Sagan -- it sounds like something he'd come up with -- who said this (paraphrasing):
"Be open-minded, but not so open that your brain falls out."
We all have our own stupid, little prejudices but I've found that as a rule, atheists seem to harbor fewer of them.
"Let he who is without disgusting, intestinal fauna fling the first faeces, eh?"
The quote, “keep an open mind, but not so open your brains fall out” has been attributed to James Oberg:
http://www.iit.edu/~cacaben/ruleofthumb.html
And, Arthur Hays Sulzberger:
http://www.phys.cwru.edu/~krauss/clark.htm
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2006 : 22:53:14 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
We all have our own stupid, little prejudices but I've found that as a rule, atheists seem to harbor fewer of them.
Of course, everyone is 'human' as they say and that is part of it to be slanted to one thing or another, race, religion, nationality, even if one thinks he's accepting.
But I've been an atheist all my life and over the years have been involved with various groups. It has been my experience that they ARE more prejudiced toward believers than the other way around.
Sure there are minority hate groups among the religious but atheists ridicule the religious across the board. More religious people than atheist, misguided as they might be in trusting in a being that doesn't exist, are sincere and try to be good people. I'm talking about individuals, the people, not the leaders who lie and swindle the believers. There are more people who are spiritual than the leaders who pretend to be honorable. I've never heard one my religious friends make fun of atheists as the way my atheists friends laugh at one who has faith. |
| Edited by - Snake on 03/17/2006 22:55:44 |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2006 : 09:59:03 [Permalink]
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Yeah anuminist! Which has only one meaning damnit! Screw google.
Someone who's philosophy lacks religious or spiritual characteristics. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2006 : 12:08:07 [Permalink]
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Lessee....:
Beatnik, Bohemian, eccentric, gonzo, hippie, maverick, original.
Howzzat?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2006 : 15:29:11 [Permalink]
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| My local Humanist group, in collaboration with the local Freethought group, have a book club and we just finished reading Doubt: A History by Jennifer Hecht. I'm going to write a review of it in the book section of this forum later. It was an excellent history of questioning belief. The author is also an award winning poet (as well as a genuine historian), and her style of prose in anything but textbooky. I recommend it as a reference book for the history of Western freethought. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 03/18/2006 15:30:11 |
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