Skeptic Friends Network

Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?
Home | Forums | Active Topics | Active Polls | Register | FAQ | Contact Us  
  Connect: Chat | SFN Messenger | Buddy List | Members
Personalize: Profile | My Page | Forum Bookmarks  
 All Forums
 Our Skeptic Forums
 Creation/Evolution
 The State of Research on ID
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

Starman
SFN Regular

Sweden
1613 Posts

Posted - 10/02/2006 :  23:54:33  Show Profile Send Starman a Private Message
Evolution News & Views - The State of Scientific Research on Intelligent Design
quote:


I keep getting asked about the scientific research projects underway that relate to Darwinism and intelligent design. So why aren't we talking more about them publicly? For several good reasons:

The most important is that the Darwinist establishment would like nothing better than to "out" research programs before they are finished. The idea is to shut down damaging evidence as early as possible. Strangle the infant in the crib. Demand answers now to questions still being explored.

Paranoia? Hardly. There are too many examples of ID scientists and other scholars who have been hassled and harassed by the Darwinist Inquisition. (I include in the Inquisition those supposed science writers who long ago became propaganda agents rather than serious reporters.)
...
We know of a lot that is happening, and it's exciting. As for the rest, we'll report it when it's ready, not before.
Poor persecuted ID-iots. So brave, so devoted, so ...

"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones

H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  00:15:14   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message
Ah, but the best quote is this:
quote:
As for foes and critics who pester us for information about research now underway and who insinuate that, unless we oblige them, we must accept their opinion that such research is not happening, we owe them nothing. Since when does a scientist have to "report" on his work to the public before he is ready?
Scientists are under no obligation to report on their work before it's ready, unless of course one has already spent millions of dollars trying to get that "work" into textbooks and classrooms. I guess in ID-Land no research actually has to be in a presentable state before you're allowed to make sweeping claims of overturning scientific paradigms.

How these jokers are still able to dupe anyone is beyond my comprehension.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
Edited by - H. Humbert on 10/03/2006 00:16:06
Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  02:32:12   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
Research on Intelligent Design.... It's rather a contradiction in terms, isn't it?

To actually do such a study, they must first establish a designer; any designer. If such can't be found, they have nothing to base their inquery on. Thus far, the Designer seems to remain somewhere in the Realms of Rhetoric, as does the research.

C'mon fellas, put up or shut up. Whadda ya got? Where's the beef?




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

Starman
SFN Regular

Sweden
1613 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  03:48:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Starman a Private Message
quote:
C'mon fellas, put up or shut up. Whadda ya got? Where's the beef?
Stop being such an evidenco-fascist, filthy!

You also know perfectly well that ID is not about the nature of the designer. Its not that kind of theory. I

"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones
Go to Top of Page

JohnOAS
SFN Regular

Australia
800 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  05:04:02   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit JohnOAS's Homepage Send JohnOAS a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Starman
Stop being such an evidenco-fascist, filthy!

You also know perfectly well that ID is not about the nature of the designer. Its not that kind of theory. I



Do you think Starman's post was cut off by the proverbial lightning bolt from above?

Of course the supreme being would find it funny to click "post" afterwards.

John's just this guy, you know.
Go to Top of Page

Ricky
SFN Die Hard

USA
4907 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  07:51:44   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Ricky an AOL message Send Ricky a Private Message
I'm curious as to what an ID lesson would look like:

"Intelligent Design is a theory which says that somewhere, at sometime, at some place, there was something, which did something to create or help create life."

After that, what the hell could you ever teach about ID that isn't a criticism of evolution?

Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov
Edited by - Ricky on 10/03/2006 07:52:27
Go to Top of Page

pleco
SFN Addict

USA
2998 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  08:33:37   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit pleco's Homepage Send pleco a Private Message
"In our lab lesson today, we will get a pile of dirt and some water and wait for it to transmogrify into something alive. We must make sure that we exclude all possibly natural causes for the transmogrification. If something happens, it must be the designer. If nothing happens, then it is because the designer didn't want it to happen."

That's REAL science.

by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart.
Go to Top of Page

Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  08:43:20   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Ricky

I'm curious as to what an ID lesson would look like:

"Intelligent Design is a theory which says that somewhere, at sometime, at some place, there was something, which did something to create or help create life."

After that, what the hell could you ever teach about ID that isn't a criticism of evolution?

I know, Ricky! I asked this a long time ago-- how, exactly, does one teach ID? The first few minutes would be spent saying stuff like "See this? It's irreducubly complex. It had to have had a designer." Then there'd be a few minutes of speculation. "The designer could be an alien. Or perhaps an extra-dimensional being. Or perhaps-- perhaps a supernatural being. Like God."

But that would be it. If a student asked "Can we figure out who the designer is?" the answer has to be "Nope." And if a student asked "How do we know what is[i/] irreducibly complex and what [i]isn't irreducibly comples, but only looks like it is because we haven't figured it out, yet?" the answer has to be "Uhhhh...."

This is particularly the case as long as the IDers pretend that they're "still working" on their theory and won't offer anything about it until it's done.
Go to Top of Page

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  16:24:12   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
That's a pretty good approach by the IDers, from a purely propaganda viewpoint. After all, they cannot even begin to do any science about their "designer," it being impossible to define the designer or design an experiment or other valid scientific research approach (notwithstanding pleco's brilliant dirt and water win-win "experiment").

So they instead say the problem's with the evil "Darwinist" scientists, who are suppressing their "scientific research." Clever! When you've got nothing to defend, attack!


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
Go to Top of Page

moakley
SFN Regular

USA
1888 Posts

Posted - 10/03/2006 :  16:38:20   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send moakley a Private Message
It is interesting since just last week we learned that Darwinism is Dead according to Jonathan Wells. If they can't do any significant ID research or get any one to sign on to do any significant ID research, could it be that Wells may have been a bit premature with his prediction.

I suspect that Wells may have been shoving food up his butt again.

Life is good

Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous
Go to Top of Page

chaloobi
SFN Regular

1620 Posts

Posted - 10/04/2006 :  09:20:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send chaloobi a Yahoo! Message Send chaloobi a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Starman

Evolution News & Views - The State of Scientific Research on Intelligent Design
quote:


I keep getting asked about the scientific research projects underway that relate to Darwinism and intelligent design. So why aren't we talking more about them publicly? For several good reasons:

The most important is that the Darwinist establishment would like nothing better than to "out" research programs before they are finished. The idea is to shut down damaging evidence as early as possible. Strangle the infant in the crib. Demand answers now to questions still being explored.

Paranoia? Hardly. There are too many examples of ID scientists and other scholars who have been hassled and harassed by the Darwinist Inquisition. (I include in the Inquisition those supposed science writers who long ago became propaganda agents rather than serious reporters.)
...
We know of a lot that is happening, and it's exciting. As for the rest, we'll report it when it's ready, not before.
Poor persecuted ID-iots. So brave, so devoted, so ...


So much for scientific transparency.

-Chaloobi

Go to Top of Page

chaloobi
SFN Regular

1620 Posts

Posted - 10/04/2006 :  09:22:10   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send chaloobi a Yahoo! Message Send chaloobi a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by JohnOAS

quote:
Originally posted by Starman
Stop being such an evidenco-fascist, filthy!

You also know perfectly well that ID is not about the nature of the designer. Its not that kind of theory. I



Do you think Starman's post was cut off by the proverbial lightning bolt from above?

Of course the supreme being would find it funny to click "post" afterwards.


Perhaps he was raptured up. Know of anyone else that's gone missing suddenly?

-Chaloobi

Go to Top of Page

JohnOAS
SFN Regular

Australia
800 Posts

Posted - 10/05/2006 :  19:11:57   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit JohnOAS's Homepage Send JohnOAS a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by chaloobi

quote:
Originally posted by JohnOAS

Do you think Starman's post was cut off by the proverbial lightning bolt from above?

Of course the supreme being would find it funny to click "post" afterwards.


Perhaps he was raptured up. Know of anyone else that's gone missing suddenly?



No, I just can't bring myself to believe that that could possibly ha

John's just this guy, you know.
Go to Top of Page

pleco
SFN Addict

USA
2998 Posts

Posted - 10/05/2006 :  19:56:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit pleco's Homepage Send pleco a Private Message
Here may be found the last words of Joseph of Arimathea. He who is valiant and pure of spirit may find the Holy Grail in the Castle of aaaaaaggghh

by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart.
Go to Top of Page

H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 10/05/2006 :  20:05:21   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message
If he was dying he wouldn't bother to carve "aaaaggghhh," he'd just say it! *














* Perhaps he was dictating.

"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
Go to Top of Page

pleco
SFN Addict

USA
2998 Posts

Posted - 10/05/2006 :  20:19:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit pleco's Homepage Send pleco a Private Message
Can't wait for the new release of MPatHG...I hope there are lots o' goodies. Apparently it is now in the proper aspect ratio. Perhaps I will get this for me birthday (which is in 2 days).

by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart.
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Jump To:

The mission of the Skeptic Friends Network is to promote skepticism, critical thinking, science and logic as the best methods for evaluating all claims of fact, and we invite active participation by our members to create a skeptical community with a wide variety of viewpoints and expertise.


Home | Skeptic Forums | Skeptic Summary | The Kil Report | Creation/Evolution | Rationally Speaking | Skeptillaneous | About Skepticism | Fan Mail | Claims List | Calendar & Events | Skeptic Links | Book Reviews | Gift Shop | SFN on Facebook | Staff | Contact Us

Skeptic Friends Network
© 2008 Skeptic Friends Network Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.22 seconds.
Powered by @tomic Studio
Snitz Forums 2000