Skeptic Friends Network

Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?
Home | Forums | Active Topics | Active Polls | Register | FAQ | Contact Us  
  Connect: Chat | SFN Messenger | Buddy List | Members
Personalize: Profile | My Page | Forum Bookmarks  
 All Forums
 Our Skeptic Forums
 Religion
 Looks Like A Job For....the ACLU!
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

Orwellingly Yurz
SFN Regular

USA
529 Posts

Posted - 11/26/2006 :  21:06:56  Show Profile Send Orwellingly Yurz a Private Message
YO! Just THIS In...but STILL fit to post...

Colo. Subdivision Bans Wreath Peace Sign 8:50 PM ET

DENVER (AP) -- A homeowners association in southwestern Colorado has threatened to fine a resident $25 a day until she removes a Christmas wreath with a peace sign that some say is an anti-Iraq war protest or a symbol of Satan.

OY sez: Yes, Peace is an invention of Satan the Prince of Darkness, not Jesus Christ, the Prince of Peace.

No doubt about it, some folks are just fuckin' out of it, I tell ya.

OY!

"The modern conservative...is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy. That is the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."
--John Kenneth Galbraith

If dogs run free
Then what must be,
Must be...
And that is all
--Bob Dylan

The neo-cons have gotten welfare for themselves down to a fine art.
--me

"The meek shall inherit the earth, but not the mineral rights."
--J. Paul Getty

"The great thing about Art isn't what it give us, but what we become through it."
--Oscar Wilde

"We have Art in order not to die of life."
--Albert Camus

"I cling like a miser to the freedom I lose when surrounded by an abundance of things."
--Albert Camus

"Experience is the name so many people give to their mistakes."
--Oscar Wilde

Chippewa
SFN Regular

USA
1496 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  13:04:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Chippewa's Homepage Send Chippewa a Private Message
My dad* used to write "666" in chalk on the sidewalk near our house sometimes. (To "scare away Jehovah's Witnesses" as he put it.)

*Dad, who has since gone on to the happy hunting grounds, was a Wildman. An Indian, MG car collector, stole and flew ME 109 during WWII, worked on the ram air turbine for Air-Research Inc, later worked on the movie "Destination Moon".



Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.

"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.)
Go to Top of Page

Original_Intent
SFN Regular

USA
609 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  13:21:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Original_Intent a Private Message
Interesting. I wonder what rights the homeowner signed away in his agreement. The condos my in-llaws live in are pretty strict on this kind of stuff. No link was posted. Is this wreath huge and gaudy?
Peace
Joe
Go to Top of Page

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  15:22:49   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Chippewa

My dad* used to write "666" in chalk on the sidewalk near our house sometimes. (To "scare away Jehovah's Witnesses" as he put it.)

*Dad, who has since gone on to the happy hunting grounds, was a Wildman. An Indian, MG car collector, stole and flew ME 109 during WWII, worked on the ram air turbine for Air-Research Inc, later worked on the movie "Destination Moon".




Wow! What a Dad!

Did he meet Robert and Ginny Heinlein on the Destination Moon set?


(Notice that, unlike the phony NASA photos, shadows make sense and stars are readily visible. This moon's the real McCoy!)


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
Edited by - HalfMooner on 11/27/2006 15:23:25
Go to Top of Page

Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25997 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  15:35:26   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message
Link to Yahoo! News.

It seems that the offense is being largely taken by the association president:
The association in this 200-home subdivision 270 miles southwest of Denver has sent a letter to [the homeowner, Jensen] saying that residents were offended by the sign and the board "will not allow signs, flags etc. that can be considered divisive."

The subdivision's rules say no signs, billboards or advertising are permitted without the consent of the architectural control committee.

[Bob] Kearns [president of the Loma Linda Homeowners Association] ordered the committee to require Jensen to remove the wreath, but members refused after concluding that it was merely a seasonal symbol that didn't say anything. Kearns fired all five committee members.


(Bolding mine.)
Something very nasty, brutish and painful has found its way up Kearns' butt, and it seems he's taking it out on anyone who crosses him in the least.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
Go to Top of Page

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  15:49:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
Could that viscous internal parasite be... Republicanism?


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
Go to Top of Page

Orwellingly Yurz
SFN Regular

USA
529 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  20:17:34   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Orwellingly Yurz a Private Message
YO, Peaceful JO. This link will take you to a photo of the satanic, peaceful Christmas wreath as displayed on the wall of the couple's home in Colorado.

http://www.durangoherald.com/asp-bin/article_generation.asp?article_type=news&article_path=/news/06/news061126_2.htm

JO, if look closely at the man and the woman in the picture, you will be able to see small horns protruding along their hairlines as well as small pointy tails extending from just above their backsides and on down between their legs. If we were both there with them, we'd probably be able to smell sulfur just like Hugo Chavez did after President Bush visited the U-N.

And yes, the wreath is big and "gaudy" and looks shockingly peaceful to me, just as Jesus would probably like for it to be.

OY, JO. And Peace.

"The modern conservative...is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy. That is the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."
--John Kenneth Galbraith

If dogs run free
Then what must be,
Must be...
And that is all
--Bob Dylan

The neo-cons have gotten welfare for themselves down to a fine art.
--me

"The meek shall inherit the earth, but not the mineral rights."
--J. Paul Getty

"The great thing about Art isn't what it give us, but what we become through it."
--Oscar Wilde

"We have Art in order not to die of life."
--Albert Camus

"I cling like a miser to the freedom I lose when surrounded by an abundance of things."
--Albert Camus

"Experience is the name so many people give to their mistakes."
--Oscar Wilde
Edited by - Orwellingly Yurz on 11/27/2006 20:18:29
Go to Top of Page

Chippewa
SFN Regular

USA
1496 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2006 :  20:21:55   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Chippewa's Homepage Send Chippewa a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by HalfMooner
Wow! What a Dad!
Did he meet Robert and Ginny Heinlein on the Destination Moon set?

I don't recall him mentioning the Heinlein's but as he was in "continuity" on the production crew, so did talk with the director, George Pal and he met the background artist Chesley Bonestell briefly. He also worked in continuity on "War of the Worlds". Parts of "Destination Moon" were shot in the Mohave Desert with starry sky matted in later.

But so as to not divert this thread: Banning a Christmas wreath with a peace sign, ("no crossbows allowed here" is the ancient origin of the symbol by the way,) sounds pretty silly. My girlfriend and I were once evicted by a Republican landlord because we placed a campaign sign for a Democrat on the lawn during election month. I kid you not! He said he would rather rent to "a fine Republican home."

Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.

"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.)
Go to Top of Page

Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie

USA
4826 Posts

Posted - 11/28/2006 :  21:58:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Valiant Dancer's Homepage Send Valiant Dancer a Private Message
Got an update from another board I post on. (OK, it's chock full of atheists with the occasional fundie chewtoy)

The HOA has reversed itself (methinks due to extreme bad press) and dropped the whole thing. (Or it might be that the HOA President got hold of a lawyer who told him presicely how screwed he'd be if he took them to court.)

Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils

Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion
Go to Top of Page

beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 11/28/2006 :  22:01:30   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
Homeowners associations and condo agreements are one of those things that bring out the one or two people who insist on perfect order. We had one of those people in one of those associations in the last house I owned. She hated the small sailboat one guy had parked in front of his house (sheesh, so it wasn't in the shape of a car), and she loved to tell us about the wonderful place in California where everyone had the same trees and little white brick fences lining the walkways. Such important things in one's life, that your ticky tacky little box on the hillside looks like the one next to it.

This news story was worse. Here these folks are putting up a war memorial on their own property with the legitimate statement they felt people were dying while so many didn't notice. The town is griping about their sign ordinance. But the worst was this snobby couple interviewed on the news piece saying how they just didn't want to be reminded.

When I was at the Vietnam Memorial in DC listening to conversations around me, this one woman was saying to her man, "we don't need to go down there [closer the the wall], we didn't know anyone who died". It really struck me what a sad attitude to have about the 55,000 names on that wall.


Go to Top of Page

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 11/28/2006 :  22:01:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer

Got an update from another board I post on. (OK, it's chock full of atheists with the occasional fundie chewtoy)

The HOA has reversed itself (methinks due to extreme bad press) and dropped the whole thing. (Or it might be that the HOA President got hold of a lawyer who told him presicely how screwed he'd be if he took them to court.)


Superb!


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
Go to Top of Page

beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 11/29/2006 :  21:06:31   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
I forgot to mention the peace symbol sign of the devil thing. (Maybe you've heard my story, I have posted it before.) I was in line at the cafeteria in the hospital I was working at during Gulf War I. The workers had drawn a big peace symbol on the daily special chalk board. This doctor in front of me turned and said he believed it was a sign of the devil. I had never heard that before. I was shocked this doctor was a religious nut. Now here is only the second time I have heard of someone calling the peace symbol a sign of the devil. People are so weird.
Go to Top of Page

beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2006 :  02:42:33   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
Well this is some fun stuff.

A history of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND) logo
One of the most widely known symbols in the world, in Britain it is recognised as standing for nuclear disarmament and in particular as the logo of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND). In the United States and much of the rest of the world it is known more broadly as the peace symbol. It was designed in 1958 by Gerald Holtom, a professional designer and artist and a graduate of the Royal College of Arts. He showed his preliminary sketches to a small group of people in the Peace News office in North London and to the Direct Action Committee Against Nuclear War, one of several smaller organisations that came together to set up CND.

There have been claims that the symbol has older, occult or anti-Christian associations. In South Africa, under the apartheid regime, there was an official attempt to ban it. Various far-right and fundamentalist American groups have also spread the idea of Satanic associations or condemned it as a Communist sign. However the origins and the ideas behind the symbol have been clearly described, both in letters and in interviews, by Gerald Holtom and his original, first sketches are now on display as part of the Commonweal Collection in Bradford.


16 pages of peace sign artwork and images is a nice collection.

about symbols.com
The power of this symbol is emphasized by the fact that the South African government, during the 1970s, seriously considered forbidding it. They found it "anti-Christian" and "pro-Communist." Achen, the late Danish semiotician, wrote that [the peace sign], ironically, was forbidden at times in some of the communist countries.

Sounds like the fact the peace symbol was used in various government protests was what earned it the reputation of being an evil sign of communism.

Fox News account, looks like the homeowners association president was a major force of one in this incident.

Some residents who have complained have children serving in Iraq, said Bob Kearns, president of the Loma Linda Homeowners Association in Pagosa Springs. He said some residents have also believed it was a symbol of Satan. Three or four residents complained, he said.

The subdivision's rules say no signs, billboards or advertising are permitted without the consent of the architectural control committee.

Kearns ordered the committee to require Jensen to remove the wreath, but members refused after concluding that it was merely a seasonal symbol that didn't say anything. Kearns fired all five committee members.


And of course, there's the Christian Resource Center's take on the symbol. It's a doozy! You have to see the graphics on the site to really appreciate the evil.

The Leftists, radicals, and Satanists who have popularised that sign...know its ancient significance very well. In fact, that 'V' sign is now used extensively by such Communist organisations as the Young Socialist Alliance, Vets for Peace in Vietnam, and the Students for a Democratic Society."

Although not a hand sign, the peace symbol itself needs to be examined.

"Known as the 'peace sign' throughout the 1960's and into the present day, this symbol is the Teutonic rune of death. 1950's peace advocate Gerald Holtom may have been commissioned by communist sympathiser Bertrand Russell to design a symbol to unite leftist peace marchers in 1958. It is clear that either Holtom or Russell deemed the Teutonic (Neronic) cross as the appropriate symbol for their cause.

"Throughout the last 2,000 years this symbol has designated hatred of Christians. Nero, who despised Christians, crucified the Apostle Peter on a cross head downward. This hideous event resembled the Teutonic cross and became a popular pagan insignia of the day. Thereafter, this sign became known as the 'Neronic cross.'

"The symbol's origin in history proves it to be the visual mystic character for 'Aum' (the split 'Y'). This is the sacred word to the Hindu. Chanting 'Aum' is supposed to help awaken 'the serpent power of Brahma' at the base of the human spine. Occultist Albert Pike also identifies this symbol as mystical in his book on Freemasonry Morals and Dogma.

The peace symbol (also called the "broken cross," "crow's foot," "witch's foot," "Nero Cross," "sign of the 'broken Jew,'" and the "symbol of the 'anti-Christ''') is actually a cross with the arms broken. It also signifies the "gesture of despair," and the "death of man.''

"The Germanic tribes who used it attributed strange and mystical properties to the sign. Such a 'rune' is said to have been used by 'black magicians' in pagan incantations and condemnations....To this very day the inverted broken cross--identical to the socialists' 'peace' symbol--is known in Germany as a 'todersrune,' or death rune. Not only was it ordered by Hitler's National Socialists that it must appear on German death notices, but it was part of the official inscription prescribed for the gravestones of Nazi officers of the dread SS. The symbol suited Nazi emphasis on pagan mysticism.''

With the arms of the cross raised in an upright position, it is "a Pythagorean emblem of the course of life, in the form of a rising path with fork roads to Good and Evil.'' It also signifies fertility, but with the arms pointing downward, it denotes evil and death.

"In fact, the inverted 'Man-rune'--the figure encircled in the common sign which the Communists tell us means 'peace'--has for centuries been a favourite sign of Satanists.''

Anton LaVey, the founder of the Church of Satan, used the peace symbol as the backdrop for his altar.

One former witch makes the following comment about the peace symbol:

"It is an ancient and powerful symbol of Antichrist. During the dark ages it was used in Druid Witchcraft and by Satanists of all sorts during the initiation of a new member to their order. They would draw the magic circle and give the initiate a cross. The initiate would then lift the cross and turn it upside down. He would then renounce Christianity in all three dimensions (sic) of time (past, present and future) and break the horizontal pieces downward forming the design of the 'Raven's Foot.' This ugly symbol is nothing short of blasphemy against the Holy Ghost. For one to wear or display this symbol is to announce either knowingly or unknowingly that you have rejected Christ. Remember, symbolism is a picture language, and a picture is worth a thousand words.''


I love the "one former witch" reference. That certainly has credibility.
Go to Top of Page

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2006 :  03:01:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
My understanding has always been that the peace sign's design was based upon two military semaphore (flag) signals: That for "N," and that for "D," with the two superimposed. The letters stood for "Nuclear Disarmament." Some people wore the symbol upside down, whereby it became "U" and "D," standing for Unilateral Disarmament.


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
Go to Top of Page

Original_Intent
SFN Regular

USA
609 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2006 :  11:47:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Original_Intent a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Orwellingly Yurz

YO, Peaceful JO. This link will take you to a photo of the satanic, peaceful Christmas wreath as displayed on the wall of the couple's home in Colorado.

http://www.durangoherald.com/asp-bin/article_generation.asp?article_type=news&article_path=/news/06/news061126_2.htm

JO, if look closely at the man and the woman in the picture, you will be able to see small horns protruding along their hairlines as well as small pointy tails extending from just above their backsides and on down between their legs. If we were both there with them, we'd probably be able to smell sulfur just like Hugo Chavez did after President Bush visited the U-N.

And yes, the wreath is big and "gaudy" and looks shockingly peaceful to me, just as Jesus would probably like for it to be.

OY, JO. And Peace.



Yo OY... Don't get all pissy now. When you post something without any links, it makes people wonder. Made me wonder if the guys will being retentive, or if the wreath might be pink with purple polka dots, and 8 feet by 8' feet, and bloking someones view.

Makes me wonder what the homeowners association rules are. When you sign them, you are stuck with them.

Now that the information is in, it's pretty cool. Thanks for the links B'gal. I like it. Peace signs are pretty darn cool. I used to make a neat red, white, and blue peace sign candle.

Had I had the information before, this wouldn't have been a problem.

Peace
Joe
Go to Top of Page

Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 11/30/2006 :  13:34:57   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
I love how they associate Vulcan with the Devil... being Vulcan was no 'sun god' - not that I know of, anyway. The only Vulcan god I know is the volcano Roman god...

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Jump To:

The mission of the Skeptic Friends Network is to promote skepticism, critical thinking, science and logic as the best methods for evaluating all claims of fact, and we invite active participation by our members to create a skeptical community with a wide variety of viewpoints and expertise.


Home | Skeptic Forums | Skeptic Summary | The Kil Report | Creation/Evolution | Rationally Speaking | Skeptillaneous | About Skepticism | Fan Mail | Claims List | Calendar & Events | Skeptic Links | Book Reviews | Gift Shop | SFN on Facebook | Staff | Contact Us

Skeptic Friends Network
© 2008 Skeptic Friends Network Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.23 seconds.
Powered by @tomic Studio
Snitz Forums 2000