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 Why do Fundamentalists Deny Global Warming?
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular

Canada
510 Posts

Posted - 02/13/2007 :  23:19:43  Show Profile Send Ghost_Skeptic a Private Message
My son is writing a paper for a hummanities course on on Religion and the Environment. The question of why fundamentalists deny global warming and the effects so vehemently has come up.

Any explanations - links to refernces would be greatly appreciated.

"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King

History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms

"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler

"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell

"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson

Edited by - Ghost_Skeptic on 02/13/2007 23:20:46

Neurosis
SFN Regular

USA
675 Posts

Posted - 02/13/2007 :  23:49:15   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Neurosis an AOL message Send Neurosis a Private Message
I think that one reason may be that humans causing the apocalypse rides contrary to god's plan to do it with some bad ass jockeys, but I don't know. The real deal may be a correlation of ignorance with ignorance. I guess that one new age idea attracts another and the same can be said of reality denying.

Facts! Pssh, you can prove anything even remotely true with facts.
- Homer Simpson

[God] is an infinite nothing from nowhere with less power over our universe than the secretary of agriculture.
- Prof. Frink

Lisa: Yes, but wouldn't you rather know the truth than to delude yourself for happiness?
Marge: Well... um.... [goes outside to jump on tampoline with Homer.]
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  00:57:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message
Yeah, I'm not 100% sure why either. Just last weekend I watch the movie Jesus Camp (which I highly recommend), and the link between between evangelical christianity and evolution/global warming denying was highlighted. Though the film didn't actually address why this link exists, I think it demonstrates how strongly these people have let political interests dominate their "religious" beliefs.

They've been brain-washed to associate anything "liberal" with sin, decadence, atheism, and moral lassitude. They literally make no distinction between liberalism and satanism. And traditionally, environmental activism has been aligned with leftist politics, since as anyone knows, any resistance to rampant pillage-and-burn consumption is sheer Communism. And as Neurosis has pointed out, because creationists have already been very successful in convincing the salt of the earth that scientists are dishonest idealogues with a godless agenda, conservative politicians in the pocket of Big Oil have had no trouble convincing fundies that Global Warming is just another media-created hoax.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
Edited by - H. Humbert on 02/14/2007 01:01:22
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beskeptigal
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USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  02:38:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
My unqualified hypothesis after reading the into to American Theocracy is they are on the side of Exxon and the other big corporations so they just blindly accept the position the big oil companies are promoting.

Jerry Falwell did say he didn't believe man was capable of destroying God's creation. That was the position of a lot of Evangelicals. There are some who think Jesus will return before we run out of oil and/or trash the climate. But a group of Evangelical leaders broke with the main group recently and decided the Bible said they should take care of the Earth.

In the book I'm reading, the Republicans and the Evangelicals and big corporations have formed a natural alliance. That's the oversimplified version anyway. I think a lot of the leaders are rich, maybe some in the oil business. They tell the flock what to believe and the flock follows.

Jon Stewart had a guest on tonight who wrote a book still claiming global warming isn't real and the scientists are all communists. At least that was Stewart's take on it and the author didn't really object to that interpretation. Stewart was good calling him on the incredibility of a conspiracy.





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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  06:22:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by beskeptigal

My unqualified hypothesis after reading the into to American Theocracy is they are on the side of Exxon and the other big corporations so they just blindly accept the position the big oil companies are promoting.
I agree with this. I think that a significant part of religious conservatives have simply learned to follow whatever it is they hear from their accepted media outlets.

Indeed, I'd argue that this was the point of the far right co-opting religious conservatives-- the plutocrats support (or at least give lip service to) various social and religious conservative ideas and in return, the religious conservatives agree to go along with financial policies (e.g. tax cuts for the rich, dismantling Social Security, etc.) even when said policies are not in their best interests.

My guess is that religious conservatives only care about global warming (in the sense that it's not real) because they've been brainwashed into thinking that environmental causes are for liberals, and therefore somehow anti-God.

Note, for instance, the regular offerings in the ultra-conservative newspaper, the Oklahoman. The largest newspaper in the state is unabashedly conservative and Christian. A few days ago, their letters to the editor were filled with anti-global warming screeds, none of which showed any real grasp of reality. A telling example:
quote:
I'm sick of the eco-freaks and their 'global warming' baloney. God is in control of the weather and He may be putting us into a deep freeze to show that He, and He alone, controls the weather.

Nadine Olivo, Holdenville
Can you imagine? Oklahoma gets an ice storm, so clearly it's God telling us that there's no global warming.

Good luck convincing this crowd of anything scientific.
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  08:01:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message
Well actually, some Evangelical groups are at the forefront in pressuring the Admin to do something/anything about global warming. So dont villify them all please.

As for those fundies who deny, I think its safe to assume that they arent using science to justify their positions and are just doing the usual regurgitation of the misinformation that the GOP party/talking heads use.

Hell we all know that its those damn Blue Fairies who are resonsible anyway and we cant go around blaming them as they will turn their malice on the dissenters.

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular

Canada
510 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  08:19:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ghost_Skeptic a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Cuneiformist

quote:
Originally posted by beskeptigal

My unqualified hypothesis after reading the into to American Theocracy is they are on the side of Exxon and the other big corporations so they just blindly accept the position the big oil companies are promoting.
I agree with this. I think that a significant part of religious conservatives have simply learned to follow whatever it is they hear from their accepted media outlets.

Indeed, I'd argue that this was the point of the far right co-opting religious conservatives-- the plutocrats support (or at least give lip service to) various social and religious conservative ideas and in return, the religious conservatives agree to go along with financial policies (e.g. tax cuts for the rich, dismantling Social Security, etc.) even when said policies are not in their best interests.

My guess is that religious conservatives only care about global warming (in the sense that it's not real) because they've been brainwashed into thinking that environmental causes are for liberals, and therefore somehow anti-God.

Note, for instance, the regular offerings in the ultra-conservative newspaper, the Oklahoman. The largest newspaper in the state is unabashedly conservative and Christian. A few days ago, their letters to the editor were filled with anti-global warming screeds, none of which showed any real grasp of reality. A telling example:
quote:
I'm sick of the eco-freaks and their 'global warming' baloney. God is in control of the weather and He may be putting us into a deep freeze to show that He, and He alone, controls the weather.

Nadine Olivo, Holdenville
Can you imagine? Oklahoma gets an ice storm, so clearly it's God telling us that there's no global warming.

Good luck convincing this crowd of anything scientific.



I don't know what the industry in the US is saying, but the Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers has at least been paying lip service to Kyoto and the industry has reduced CO2 emssions from their operations. Their official position is that there is a problem and something has to be done but we aren't going to be able to meet the targets on schedule.

The Alberta Provincial Government are lagging behind the oil industry on this never mind the fundies and the other numerous deniers that still abound in this province. I just heard on that the "Liberal" (actually conservative) government in British Columbia has "Got Religion" on this issue and is saying the "science is real and there is no room for procrastination". New coal fired power plants in BC will have to sequester all their CO2 emmissions and flaring solution gas from oil wells will be banned.

"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King

History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms

"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler

"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell

"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson
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HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  10:05:34   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Ghost_Skeptic

My son is writing a paper for a hummanities course on on Religion and the Environment. The question of why fundamentalists deny global warming and the effects so vehemently has come up.

Any explanations - links to refernces would be greatly appreciated.

In another thread, I tried to ask old Bill, but he wouldn't reply. Doesn't make sense to me (GW denial by fundies, or Bill). Seems unbiblical.

I think it may simply be part of their knee-jerk reactionary hatred and distrust of science and larnin' in general.


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
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JohnOAS
SFN Regular

Australia
800 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  16:57:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit JohnOAS's Homepage Send JohnOAS a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by H. Humbert

Yeah, I'm not 100% sure why either. Just last weekend I watch the movie Jesus Camp (which I highly recommend), and the link between between evangelical christianity and evolution/global warming denying was highlighted. Though the film didn't actually address why this link exists, I think it demonstrates how strongly these people have let political interests dominate their "religious" beliefs.


I just read a bunch of the comments on the IMDB page. Some were great, and some are just plain disturbing and scary.

I don't know that it'll hit the shelves here in any great numbers, but I'll certainly keep an eye out. Thanks!

John's just this guy, you know.
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Hawks
SFN Regular

Canada
1383 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  17:15:25   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Hawks's Homepage Send Hawks a Private Message
The uncommondescent (ID) website seems highly skeptical about the idea that humans are causing global warming. They quote canadian climatologist Tim Ball as saying: "Sadly, my experience is that universities are the most dogmatic and oppressive places in our society. This becomes progressively worse as they receive more and more funding from governments that demand a particular viewpoint.". This seems to sum up most ID-supporters view of "the establishment" (meaning universities and by extension science). After all, scientists came up with evolution and they don't believe that, so why should they believe it when scientists claim that humans cause global warming. So, I would agree with H. Humbert's view that it's because they think that scientists are dishonest idealogues.

METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden!
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2007 :  17:32:42   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Hawks

The uncommondescent (ID) website seems highly skeptical about the idea that humans are causing global warming. They quote canadian climatologist Tim Ball as saying: "Sadly, my experience is that universities are the most dogmatic and oppressive places in our society. This becomes progressively worse as they receive more and more funding from governments that demand a particular viewpoint."
But as we've established on another thread, Dr Ball is more or less a shill paid a hefty sum by energy companies to say whatever it is they want-- in this case, that global warming isn't real...
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Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 02/16/2007 :  22:59:50   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message
The fundamentalist movement in the US isn't a religious movement, but a political one.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard

USA
4907 Posts

Posted - 02/17/2007 :  19:12:42   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Ricky an AOL message Send Ricky a Private Message
For Christians, one of the many lessons of Genesis is that God created the world for humans. As such, humans own the world and can do whatever they please with it. On the other hand, from an evolutionary viewpoint, we are a result of the world, and we should work within it to make it better.

Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie

USA
4826 Posts

Posted - 02/17/2007 :  20:37:41   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Valiant Dancer's Homepage Send Valiant Dancer a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Ghost_Skeptic

My son is writing a paper for a hummanities course on on Religion and the Environment. The question of why fundamentalists deny global warming and the effects so vehemently has come up.

Any explanations - links to refernces would be greatly appreciated.



Unfortunately, I have no links to sources, however, I have read and listened to several discussions on this point.

The Fundies believe that the book of Genesis gives clear indications that man has full dominion over earth and it's creatures. As such, it is man right to do with it whatever he pleases as God will make sure it will be available for all the generations of man to come. Since many of these also believe we are living in the "end times", they see no need for conservation because it is all ending soon anyway. In addition, they see their job is to subdue the earth and it's animals to serve man.

The source for the assertation they have is Genesis 1:26-31 (KJV)

I'll post it here.

26. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28. And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
29. And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
30. And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.
31. And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.


Link this with the need for science in general to be wrong to be able to prop up Young Earth Creationism, and you have the trifecta of fundamentalist extremist doctorine.

Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils

Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion
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