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 Chimps hunting with spears WOW just WOW!
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  01:49:04  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Chimpanzees have been seen using spears to hunt bush babies, U.S. researchers said on Thursday
quote:
in a study that demonstrates a whole new level of tool use and planning by our closest living relatives.

Perhaps even more intriguing, it was only the females who fashioned and used the wooden spears, Jill Pruetz and Paco Bertolani of Iowa State University reported.

Bertolani saw an adolescent female chimp use a spear to stab a bush baby as it slept in a tree hollow, pull it out and eat it.

Pruetz thought it was a fluke when Bertolani saw the adolescent female hunt and kill the bush baby, a tiny nocturnal primate.

But then she saw almost the same thing. "I saw the behavior over the course of 19 days almost daily," she said.



No comment needed.

Edited by - beskeptigal on 02/23/2007 01:49:26

HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  03:28:53   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
Really neat! One has to wonder how many times that line of chimps has invented the spear, and lost it again. Or whether they may have been using it for millions if years. I would not mind at all calling those brilliant chimps my distant relatives.

Of course the Creationists, if the don't just try to ignore this, will just say the researchers were wrong, and were actually watching a tribe of pygmies.


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
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Paulos23
Skeptic Friend

USA
446 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  05:54:58   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Paulos23's Homepage Send Paulos23 a Private Message
Awww, they are just aping us.

You can go wrong by being too skeptical as readily as by being too trusting. -- Robert A. Heinlein

Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  06:01:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message
Well dont burn your holy books just yet people, this behavior was seen only by one person and was not documented. Still a cool idea though...

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular

USA
609 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  06:08:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Original_Intent a Private Message
I can see it. They have been using sticks for all sorts of things (measuring water levels, digging, rooting out bugs. The stick is their friend.

I'd love to see more.

Peace
Joe
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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  06:08:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf

Well dont burn your holy books just yet people, this behavior was seen only by one person and was not documented. Still a cool idea though...

Agree..

But why not? Chimps have hands nearly as dexterous as our own and they are certainly smart enough to learn. Fishing for termites is a learned behavior actively taught (by example) by mothers to offspring.

The Theory of Evolution sez: "If necessity demands, species will compensate." It just might take a while...




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  22:45:33   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf

Well dont burn your holy books just yet people, this behavior was seen only by one person and was not documented. Still a cool idea though...

No Pops, it was well documented.

Here's the original paper. Savanna Chimpanzees, Pan troglodytes verus, Hunt with Tools

And the abstract and access to the text version if you don't want to download the pdf file.

There are also links to a couple videos. I didn't want to watch a bushbaby get stabbed and eaten so I haven't viewed those.





Edited by - beskeptigal on 02/23/2007 22:48:00
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
25975 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  23:06:12   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message
It seems that the bushbaby is actually inside a hollow tree. The first video shows a stabbing motion, but that's about all I could make out. It's not particularly impressive to this layman's eye, except that it's quite obvious that the chimp not only knows how to kill with a crooked stick, but also knows that jumping up and down on the tree way far up the trunk will crack it open down near where the prey is. That's impressive.

The second and third videos are of nothing but a couple of chimps eating. Real yawners.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Randy
SFN Regular

USA
1988 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2007 :  23:39:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Randy a Private Message


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HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 02/24/2007 :  06:39:24   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
So, let me get this straight: Chimps females have figured out that putting pointy ends on sticks makes them into handy hunting tools. Those gals are so smart! I gotta get me one of those sticks, and a chimp technician to sharpen it for me!


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 02/24/2007 :  12:26:53   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message
Ahem, touche. Im still more impressed with the grey parrot, but I guess its not the chimps fault that they dont have the right throat to mimic our vocalizations

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini
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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 02/24/2007 :  15:06:35   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
The word seems to have travled fast and far.
quote:
Armed Chimps Draw Mixed Reviews
NRA: "Welcome to the Club!"

Seems everybody has thoughts on it, even some who don't think.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

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HalfMooner
Dingaling

Philippines
15831 Posts

Posted - 02/24/2007 :  17:34:50   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send HalfMooner a Private Message
Nicely written!


Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive.
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 02/24/2007 :  23:03:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
That's great, filthy.
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular

Canada
510 Posts

Posted - 02/25/2007 :  09:11:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ghost_Skeptic a Private Message
It is a logical extension from fishing for termites with stick -primarily done be females - males get there protien by hunting monkeys - so I am not surpised it was a female doing this.

"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King

History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms

"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler

"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell

"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson
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smoke
New Member

USA
32 Posts

Posted - 03/01/2007 :  00:17:22   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit smoke's Homepage Send smoke a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by beskeptigal

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070222/sc_nm/chimps_hunting_dc_1WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Chimpanzees have been seen using spears to hunt bush babies


And when we see crows using sticks to do the same, we don't say anything.

He does not answer when men cry out because of the arrogance of the wicked. Indeed, God does not listen to their empty plea; the Almighty pays no attention to it.

Job 35:12-13
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