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the_ignored
SFN Addict
2562 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 11:23:52 [Permalink]
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From Bill Scott:
So should a "productive life of public service" be all that is needed to beat a manslaughter or murder charge for everyone, or just powerful liberal dem senators? |
How's about former Republican presidents who lied to start a war which resulted in a few hundred thousand military and civilian deaths?
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>From: enuffenuff@fastmail.fm
(excerpt follows):
> I'm looking to teach these two bastards a lesson they'll never forget.
> Personal visit by mates of mine. No violence, just a wee little chat.
>
> **** has also committed more crimes than you can count with his
> incitement of hatred against a religion. That law came in about 2007
> much to ****'s ignorance. That is fact and his writing will become well
> know as well as him becoming a publicly known icon of hatred.
>
> Good luck with that fuckwit. And Reynold, fucking run, and don't stop.
> Disappear would be best as it was you who dared to attack me on my
> illness knowing nothing of the cause. You disgust me and you are top of
> the list boy. Again, no violence. Just regular reminders of who's there
> and visits to see you are behaving. Nothing scary in reality. But I'd
> still disappear if I was you.
What brought that on? this. Original posting here.
Another example of this guy's lunacy here. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 08/26/2009 : 11:37:57 [Permalink]
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"8/26/2009
A Message on Ted Kennedy to Conservatives Who Hated Him (Mostly Profanity-Free for the Kiddies):
Let's just get this right:
Do you like your state and not the federal government controlling the curriculum of your kids' schools? Thank Ted Kennedy.
Do you like being able to vote starting at age 18? Thank Ted Kennedy.
Do you think low-income people should get help with heating their homes in the winter? Thank the man.
Do you think the federal government should fund cancer research? Yep.
Do you believe that Meals on Wheels is a good thing? Ditto.
Does your daughter (or you, if you're female) like playing soccer or basketball or softball at school? That'd be because of Ted Kennedy.
Do you think that disabled people should be able to go to school? Have access to buildings? Not be discriminated against for housing and loads of other things? Kennedy, big time.
You like your cheap airfares? You know the answer.
You think people on welfare oughta get jobs? So did Kennedy.
You think mental institutions should treat people humanely? Yeah, so did your new friend, Ted Kennedy.
You believe that the Defense Department should provide child care for the kids of soldiers? Kennedy did.
You think a woman shouldn't lose her job if she gets pregnant? You think 100,000 more cops on the street's a good idea? You think poor kids should have health care? You think soldiers in Iraq should have the proper armor? Just tick those things off the list. Some of them would have been accomplished without him; many would not have been.
You agreed with Ted Kennedy far, far more than you want to think you did, dear conservatives. Still, go ahead and dance your mad jigs on his still-warm corpse. Why not? We on the left certainly did when Jerry Falwell, Strom Thurmond, and Jesse Helms kicked. Hell, one asshole blogger even celebrated the death of Ann Coulter's father. But know that you dance in ignorance. Ask Orrin Hatch.
But, of course, you want to address the far more pressing issue of whether or not Ted Kennedy killed Mary Jo Kopechne back at Chappaquiddick all those decades ago, no matter what the investigations said. There's only a couple of things to say about that: The glib response is, "Yeah, and Thomas Jefferson nailed his slaves. What's your point?" More directly, Kennedy asked the people of Massachusetts if they wanted him to quit. They did not. The rest of the nation may have not wanted him as president, but for Massachusetts, Chappaquiddick quickly became a settled issue and distant history. That's all that mattered to keep him in the Senate, just like Louisiana will have to judge whether or not a prostitute-lovin' David Vitter should go back. That's democracy, gang, like it or not.
And Ted Kennedy did more for real, actual democracy than almost anyone else in our entire history as a nation.
More on that tomorrow in a real tribute.
(By the way, perhaps we now know why Barack Obama was trying to get health care reform done quickly.)" ~~ The Rude Pundit
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:05:57 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
A coward and a jerk is someone who gets drunk on a phony hunting trip, shoots his friend in the face, then waits some 14 hours, until he's sobered up, to report it.
A coward and a jerk is someone who phonies up terror alerts for political gain.
A coward and a jerk is someone who freezes up, then deserts his post in time of crisis.
A coward and a a jerk is a holder of office that won't allow dissenting views anywhere near him.
A coward and a jerk is someone who invades a sovereign country on false premises.
A coward and a jerk is someone who deserts the military, to be bailed out by his father when he should have stood courts martial.
A coward and a jerk is someone who disrupts town hall meetings and even openly carries firearms to them to intimidate others.
In short, "coward" and "jerk" has become synonymous with "Republican."
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None of this changes the fact that someone who leaves his girlfriend for dead and then lies about it because he is afraid of the scandal driving drunk with your mistress will cause is beyond a coward and a jerk. I believe killer is more appropriate.
| Ted Kennedy had his faults and he made his mistakes, |
I would say that killing someone and then lying about it fits into the faults and mistakes category.
| Chappaquiddick being a huge one, but he was anything but a coward and a jerk. |
How about a killer and a lier then? |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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| Edited by - Bill scott on 08/26/2009 12:32:57 |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:08:35 [Permalink]
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I'm sad that Ted Kennedy is gone. The very health of a nation is threatened by his death.
I saw him speak outside the US Grant Hotel in San Diego in 1960, when he warmed up a crowd for his brother, John, who was running for President. The consensus in that crowd was that he was an even better public speaker than JFK.
As a senator, Ted Kennedy became the tireless proponent of universal health care for Americans. When and if a decent national health care system is finally passed into law, it ought to be named the Ted Kennedy Health Care Act.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:10:57 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
Lemme ask you something Bill; while Chappaquiddick was bad shit, everyone agrees, what else do you have on ol' Teddy's fifty years of devoted service to our country? Or are you a one-trick pony on this'n?
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Are you saying devoted public service is all that is needed to make good on manslaughter? If so I would say there are a lot of people currently in prison who would like to take Ted's seat in the senate so they can have a chance at righting their wrongs, if your saying devoted public service can negate manslaughter that is. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:20:46 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by HalfMooner
I'm sad that Ted Kennedy is gone. The very health of a nation is threatened by his death.
I saw him speak outside the US Grant Hotel in San Diego in 1960, when he warmed up a crowd for his brother, John, who was running for President. The consensus in that crowd was that he was an even better public speaker than JFK.
As a senator, Ted Kennedy became the tireless proponent of universal health care for Americans. When and if a decent national health care system is finally passed into law, it ought to be named the Ted Kennedy Health Care Act.
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He reminds me of Pete Rose. Everyone knows he is guilty so just come out already and own up to driving drunk with your mistress resulting in her death and then lying about it to cover it up. But that would be the man thing to do. The jerk and coward way is to go all the way to his grave denying the whole time what everyone already knows is true. People with remorse own up to their "mistakes". Cowards and jerks carry their manslaughter secrets to the grave. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:32:27 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
"8/26/2009
A Message on Ted Kennedy to Conservatives Who Hated Him (Mostly Profanity-Free for the Kiddies):
Let's just get this right:
Do you like your state and not the federal government controlling the curriculum of your kids' schools? Thank Ted Kennedy.
Do you like being able to vote starting at age 18? Thank Ted Kennedy.
Do you think low-income people should get help with heating their homes in the winter? Thank the man.
Do you think the federal government should fund cancer research? Yep.
Do you believe that Meals on Wheels is a good thing? Ditto.
Does your daughter (or you, if you're female) like playing soccer or basketball or softball at school? That'd be because of Ted Kennedy.
Do you think that disabled people should be able to go to school? Have access to buildings? Not be discriminated against for housing and loads of other things? Kennedy, big time.
You like your cheap airfares? You know the answer.
You think people on welfare oughta get jobs? So did Kennedy.
You think mental institutions should treat people humanely? Yeah, so did your new friend, Ted Kennedy.
You believe that the Defense Department should provide child care for the kids of soldiers? Kennedy did.
You think a woman shouldn't lose her job if she gets pregnant? You think 100,000 more cops on the street's a good idea? You think poor kids should have health care? You think soldiers in Iraq should have the proper armor? Just tick those things off the list. Some of them would have been accomplished without him; many would not have been.
You agreed with Ted Kennedy far, far more than you want to think you did, dear conservatives. Still, go ahead and dance your mad jigs on his still-warm corpse. Why not? We on the left certainly did when Jerry Falwell, Strom Thurmond, and Jesse Helms kicked. Hell, one asshole blogger even celebrated the death of Ann Coulter's father. But know that you dance in ignorance. Ask Orrin Hatch.
But, of course, you want to address the far more pressing issue of whether or not Ted Kennedy killed Mary Jo Kopechne back at Chappaquiddick all those decades ago, no matter what the investigations said. There's only a couple of things to say about that: The glib response is, "Yeah, and Thomas Jefferson nailed his slaves. What's your point?" More directly, Kennedy asked the people of Massachusetts if they wanted him to quit. They did not. The rest of the nation may have not wanted him as president, but for Massachusetts, Chappaquiddick quickly became a settled issue and distant history. That's all that mattered to keep him in the Senate, just like Louisiana will have to judge whether or not a prostitute-lovin' David Vitter should go back. That's democracy, gang, like it or not.
And Ted Kennedy did more for real, actual democracy than almost anyone else in our entire history as a nation.
More on that tomorrow in a real tribute.
(By the way, perhaps we now know why Barack Obama was trying to get health care reform done quickly.)" ~~ The Rude Pundit
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| But, of course, you want to address the far more pressing issue of whether or not Ted Kennedy killed Mary Jo Kopechne back at Chappaquiddick all those decades ago, no matter what the investigations said. There's only a couple of things to say about that: The glib response is, "Yeah, and Thomas Jefferson nailed his slaves. What's your point?" |
My point is that TJ having sex with his slaves in no way justifies TK leaving his mistress for dead to avoid a political scandal or a manslaughter charge. Pointing out bad behavior by others to cover up or justify ones own bad behavior is the cowards way out. Not to mention it makes one come off as a jerk. Leaving your girlfriend for dead to protect your political career and power is just not cool. But apparently it's nothing a little devoted public service can't make go away. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:38:29 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by the_ignored
From Bill Scott:
So should a "productive life of public service" be all that is needed to beat a manslaughter or murder charge for everyone, or just powerful liberal dem senators? |
How's about former Republican presidents who lied to start a war which resulted in a few hundred thousand military and civilian deaths?
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Nope. A "productive life of public service" would no more negate this then it would manslaughter. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 12:39:10 [Permalink]
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Bill repeatedly states stuff like this: | No, a coward and a jerk is someone who leaves his girlfriend to die in a submerged car because he don't want his wife to find out about his cheating and the police to find out about his drinking. So what if the girl dies the powerful senator is looking at a possible scandal here if this goes public. |
Did you forget that this is a forum for skepticism? Seeing as the incident happened 9 years before I was even born, I wasn't aware of it, so I read the entire Wikipedia article that you, Bill, posted. You have now more than once stated that the woman who died was Kennedy's girlfriend, which was never established. Here's an article about Mary Jo Kopechne: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Jo_Kopechne Clearly the woman was ambitious in her career and had been quite close to Robert Kennedy. It makes total sense that both she and Ted Kennedy would be at that reunion party that night, and I fail to see how him offering her a ride proves that they were having an affair. What does it say about your character, Bill, that your malice toward Kennedy compels you to tarnish this woman's reputation post mortem?
Additionally, you refer to Kennedy's action as at least "manslaughter" and at worst "murder" and also refer to him as a "killer." Murder refers to killing with intent. Given the circumstances of the evening, that just doesn't make any goddamn sense. Obviously Kennedy would face more political problems if Kopechne died than had she survived the accident.
The accusation of "manslaughter" is also questionable. If we simply take the facts of the incident at face value, all we know is that a car accident occurred while Kennedy was driving, Kennedy escaped the car as it was submerged, Kopechne did not escape and perished. Of course the most sensible and lawful action in that moment would have been for Kennedy to go right to authorities. Seeing as Kopechne drowned and this is the time before cellphones, I fail to see how Kennedy on foot and with a concussion and other injuries would have prevented the Kopechne's death by going to authorities right away or doing anything else. It sounds like he was living a real nightmare scenario, and it's pretty damn callous of you to assume that the only thing Kennedy was thinking about in those moments was his political reputation. Equally callous to suggest that he even intended to kill Kopechne when there is absolutely no evidence to suggest that what-so-ever. A typical human being of healthy psychology would be devastated personally by such an incident. Why do you assume that Kennedy is not typical in this respect? Do you honestly think that Kennedy had ideas about somehow covering up the entire incident? He'd have to be a moron to seriously entertain such thoughts, much less act on them. The simpler and more believable explanation is that he was acting irrationally because of his injuries and being in a state of distress.
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"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 08/26/2009 12:40:32 |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 13:49:49 [Permalink]
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Bill:
Cowards and jerks carry their manslaughter secrets to the grave. |
If it's a secret, how can you be so sure? And by the way, he did confess to being drunk and leaving the scene and he was convicted for those crimes. But hey...he was a liberal. You don't run here and complain about Dick Cheney's crimes. (Everyone knows he's guilty.) Or any other conservative for that matter. Not a peep out of you.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 14:04:19 [Permalink]
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Yep, one trick pony -- figgered that. Bill, why don't you give Mary Jo a rest and go on to something else, hm? Back in the day, our Teddy was quite a lush. Why don't you work the booze angle for a while?
Marf has given a pretty concise description of what happened, and while my memory of the event is a bit hazy -- lots of my memories are these days -- it is pretty much as I recall it.
You and the rest of the slavering conservatives might not like it but you're gonna have to live with this; for all of his faults, Kennedy was still among the greatest senators ever to be in that chamber. He had something the conservatives have never had nor ever will: a compassionate heart.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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the_ignored
SFN Addict
2562 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 14:08:17 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Originally posted by the_ignored
From Bill Scott:
So should a "productive life of public service" be all that is needed to beat a manslaughter or murder charge for everyone, or just powerful liberal dem senators? |
How's about former Republican presidents who lied to start a war which resulted in a few hundred thousand military and civilian deaths?
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Nope. A "productive life of public service" would no more negate this then it would manslaughter.
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So why are you ranting over one death, while not saying anything about the many thousands of definately deliberate deaths caused by Bush and Co?
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>From: enuffenuff@fastmail.fm
(excerpt follows):
> I'm looking to teach these two bastards a lesson they'll never forget.
> Personal visit by mates of mine. No violence, just a wee little chat.
>
> **** has also committed more crimes than you can count with his
> incitement of hatred against a religion. That law came in about 2007
> much to ****'s ignorance. That is fact and his writing will become well
> know as well as him becoming a publicly known icon of hatred.
>
> Good luck with that fuckwit. And Reynold, fucking run, and don't stop.
> Disappear would be best as it was you who dared to attack me on my
> illness knowing nothing of the cause. You disgust me and you are top of
> the list boy. Again, no violence. Just regular reminders of who's there
> and visits to see you are behaving. Nothing scary in reality. But I'd
> still disappear if I was you.
What brought that on? this. Original posting here.
Another example of this guy's lunacy here. |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 14:10:54 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
But hey...he was a liberal. You don't run here and complain about Dick Cheney's crimes. (Everyone knows he's guilty.) Or any other conservative for that matter. Not a peep out of you. |
Let's be honest. Bill has no point to being here other than to provoke us "libruls." He doesn't really give a shit about Ted Kennedy's supposed cowardly or immoral act. He's not genuinely outraged or indignant. This is just an opportunity for him to jeer the other team. Because Bill has no morals. No conscience. Facts don't matter to him. We've seen this time and time again. The man is scum.
And hey, if the only dirt he can dredge up on Kennedy is some 40 year old accident, well, then that will have to suffice for Bill to get his rocks off. The man is pathetic in his predictable adherence to the Republican script. He probably hasn't had an original thought in decades.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
| Edited by - H. Humbert on 08/26/2009 14:14:41 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 14:23:18 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Q: So should a "productive life of public service" be all that is needed to beat a manslaughter or murder charge for everyone, or just powerful liberal dem senators? |
Q: Have you stopped beating your wife, Bill?| No, a coward and a jerk is someone who leaves his girlfriend to die in a submerged car because he don't want his wife to find out about his cheating and the police to find out about his drinking. So what if the girl dies the powerful senator is looking at a possible scandal here if this goes public. |
It went public. What more do you want? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Ted Kennedy has died
