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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 10/28/2010 : 08:08:25 [Permalink]
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As far as I have been able to find out, these were not professional security personnel, but some off-the-street hacks. A pro would have simply escorted the lady to the door and told her not to come back, then called the cops if she did not comply.
Oh, and hey, how 'bout the titty-grab by the scumbag in the checked shirt? It showed up quite clearly in the video. How professional was that, eh?
Heh, if you wear a tea party shirt, you won't be allowed in the polls no matter who you walk past. That would be considered political advertising and is frowned on by federal, election law. And by the bye, why the Black Panthers? They've been pretty much defunct for some decades, although a new group has been founded in TX fairly recently. Are you trying to scare someone with a sixties/seventies threat? In my own case at least, it didn't work then and it ain't workin' now.
I am reasonably sure that the percentage of woman-beaters within their ranks is no higher than the national average, however, while I can't verify it, yet, it seems that hard-line conservatives are more likely to be such.
I would like to attend a teabagger's rally just to watch the freak show. Some of those turkeys are high-larious.
Edit: A funny thing about trial lawyers: Everybody hates them until they need one. I hope that Ms. Velle, if she decides to go for it, gets a good one.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 10/28/2010 08:23:15 |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 08:23:12 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Fripp |
| So you're alright with a group of men "flexing their muscles" by stomping on a woman's head? |
Well first off it was not a group of men. One man stepped on her head with his sneakers and as I told Dave the take down was fully justified but the sneaker on the head was not necessary.
Yeah, I'm the internet bad azz.
I never threatened you. |
This isn't a direct attack and insult? |
No. You called me a internet bad ass because I told you to wear a tea party shirt past the black panthers at a voting station. You then asked me to list examples where you were acting like a tough guy so I posted numerous examples and now you keep asking me if that was a threat or insult from me to you. I don't understand why this is confusing you so?
| Grow a sack. You launched a direct personal attack in response to a reply that wasn't directed towards you in any manner. |
What personal attack? Because I said "Go Army"? Give me a fricking break.
| Bill, quit trying to shift the blame to anyone other than those Tea Party cowards. Bill, you would have earned a lot more respect had you said something like, "I'm a Rand Paul fan, but what these guys did was reprehensible" |
I hardly know a thing about Paul and I already said the take down was justified while the sneaker on the head was a bit over the top. The lady looked just fine last night on MSNBC. People don't get up from boot stompings so let's stop the non-sense right here.
| So Bill, What Would Jesus Do? Would he have wrestled her to the ground and stomped on her head? How many of his disciples would have helped him? |
One man stepped on her head and I have said mutable times now that that was unnecessary, while the original take down was completely justified. Stop beating a dead horse.
| Would your long-haired savior vote for Rand after witnessing this? |
That I do not know. I suppose he would have to live in Kentucky first.
| Isn't Rand Paul one of those "personal responsibility" guys? So why didn't he take personal responsibility for his own defense? |
Sure, why don't all public figures travel without security while making public appearances? Why does the president need his SS guys? Can't the man take care of himself?
| How about personal responsibility for the actions of these staff members? |
Maybe the cops will charge the guy or maybe not but what do you want from Paul? For him to go to jail for the actions of others?
| What was so scary about this woman? Was Rand "fluffy boy" Paul, mail-order ophthalmologist-degree extraordinaire, afraid she was going to muss up his vintage-70s perm? |
She could have had a knife or a gun. Duh! Again, when someone is defiant and avoiding security to make direct contact with a public figure making a public appearance who knows what their final intentions are? That is just how Hinkle approached Reagan before shooting him so who knows? I figure an ex-navy seal ouught to know this: Expect the unexpected.
So not only are you the local resident internet bad azz but your the resident internet physic as well?
| Unwarranted direct insults from hypocritical internet cowards will tend to do that. |
Dude I had no idea this Army/Navy thing was such a sensitive subject or I never would have brought it up |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 08:32:23 [Permalink]
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Filthy asked:
| And by the bye, why the Black Panthers? |
Because Billy's prophet (glenn beck) has been showing the same 5 seconds of video, which shows 2 black guys looking all rasta, standing outside a voting center. Its always the same two guys, always the same 5 seconds of video, but somehow that leads them to conclude there is a black panther uprising aimed at threatening white voters. Beck shows the clip, howls at the moon, and scares poor billy here.
There is no black panther effort to intimidate voters, just like ACORN never messed with an election. It's just more racist bullshit from the fucktards at FAUX, and people like billy grab that cowpie, slap it between two slices of bread, add some of Beck's crazysauce, and chow down.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 08:50:40 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Fripp |
| but I take it that you're fine with a bunch of men beating up on a woman? |
Oh that is rich. For the last time anybody, man, women or child forcing their way through security to confront a public figure at a public appearance is risking a hard take down. Any logical person would know this coming into the confrontation. The "bunch of men" took the gal to the ground and that was it, while one man, acting on his own, felt the need to put his sneaker on her head. I do not condone the sneaker on the head but the original take down is fully justified.
| Or only as long as the men were Teabaggers and the woman is a liberal, right? |
Your just making stuff up.
| Should she apologize for her head getting in the way of his stomping foot? |
No. But she should apologize for ignoring security in the first place. The original take down is all on her shoulders
| Was she a serious threat to fluff-boy? |
No one knew at the time, but she could have been and so every threat must me taken seriously. I am surprised an old Seal does not get or understand this. She easily could have been carry a little pistol under her baggy cloths.
| No evasion, Bill. Yes or No answers only. |
At the time nobody knew. You keep going back to the fact that she is a gal. Last I knew gals could shoot guns, stab people with knives or even carry explosives. When properly armed little gals can even take down 195 pound ex seals with one nice placed shot. You never know who is a threat and so you have to assume all breaches of security are threats until confirmed otherwise. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 09:00:33 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dude
Filthy asked:
| And by the bye, why the Black Panthers? |
Because Billy's prophet (glenn beck) has been showing the same 5 seconds of video, which shows 2 black guys looking all rasta, standing outside a voting center. Its always the same two guys, always the same 5 seconds of video, but somehow that leads them to conclude there is a black panther uprising aimed at threatening white voters. Beck shows the clip, howls at the moon, and scares poor billy here.
There is no black panther effort to intimidate voters, just like ACORN never messed with an election. It's just more racist bullshit from the fucktards at FAUX, and people like billy grab that cowpie, slap it between two slices of bread, add some of Beck's crazysauce, and chow down.
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But of course MSNBC playing one 5 second clip 5000 times in one night for the sole purpose of getting the zombies in a frenzy over one man with his sneaker on the head of someone who broke through security is just fine with dude. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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podcat
Skeptic Friend
435 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 09:13:15 [Permalink]
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Just to clarify, technically the man wasn't stomping her head, but he did put his foot down on her shoulders and force her to the ground, and her head may have hit the concrete. I would consider that assault.
Okay, not a group of men doing this. I see four or five people, two or three of them assaulting her. What would you consider to be a group?
You keep referring to "security". There were no trained security personnel in that video.
Also, you don't need to have a scratch on you to have a concussion. |
“In a modern...society, everybody has the absolute right to believe whatever they damn well please, but they don't have the same right to be taken seriously”.
-Barry Williams, co-founder, Australian Skeptics |
| Edited by - podcat on 10/28/2010 09:20:39 |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 09:58:37 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by podcat |
| Just to clarify, technically the man wasn't stomping her head, but he did put his foot down on her shoulders and force her to the ground, and her head may have hit the concrete. I would consider that assault. |
The point being if some tea party gal forced her way through security and resisted on several occasions and was now within touching distance of Obama and the secret service took her down to the ground while one of the SS had his foot on her head holding her down I would be willing to bet my next pay check that MSNBC and their spin machine would be singing a much different tune.
| Okay, not a group of men doing this. I see four or five people, two or three of them assaulting her. What would you consider to be a group? |
A group could be 3 or 4 men that is not what I am disputing. I dispute the assault accusations against all except the sneaker guy. They simply took to the ground, for all they know a crazed ideology with deadly intentions, for breaching security and forcing her way to Paul. While I find the sneaker on the head unnecessary I'll let the local authorities decide if it merits assault charges.
| Also, you don't need to have a scratch on you to have a concussion. |
You do if you get the concussion via a real tried and true boot stomping. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Fripp
SFN Regular
USA
727 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 10:10:25 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
This isn't a direct attack and insult? |
| Grow a sack. You launched a direct personal attack in response to a reply that wasn't directed towards you in any manner. |
What personal attack? Because I said "Go Army"? Give me a fricking break.
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Nice selective quoting. You conveniently left this out:
From you:
Those Black Panthers will beat your skinny little ex-navy seal ass so silly with their billy clubs that you will be mumbling "Go Army!!!!" by the time they are finished with you.
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Emphasis mine.
| Unwarranted direct insults from hypocritical internet cowards will tend to do that. |
Dude I had no idea this Army/Navy thing was such a sensitive subject or I never would have brought it up
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Since you keep pretending not to notice your response to a comment that was not directed at you, I'll post your response to me, again.
Those Black Panthers will beat your skinny little ex-navy seal ass so silly with their billy clubs that you will be mumbling "Go Army!!!!" by the time they are finished with you.
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You obviously take any criticism of any Teabagger very personally to have such a visceral response. But why do you keep avoiding explaining the attack?
BTW, why were so intimidated by those "big, bad" guys? They aren't very threatening. A billy club is useless in grappling range, and I doubt they've had any training on effective use of said club
I don't have the time to do a line-by-line response of the rest of your post. Others have already dissected most of your silly points but...
| Well first off it was not a group of men. |
... five males aren't a "group of men"? Bill, you're getting more and more ridiculous the deeper you dig yourself. |
"What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon?"
"Oh, I'm sorry. I thought my Dark Lord of the Sith could protect a small thermal exhaust port that's only 2-meters wide! That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! You have any idea what this is going to do to my credit?!?!"
"What? Oh, oh, 'just rebuild it'? Oh, real [bleep]ing original. And who's gonna give me a loan, jackhole? You? You got an ATM on that torso LiteBrite?" |
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podcat
Skeptic Friend
435 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 10:37:35 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
| Originally posted by Fripp |
You said in response to Fripp:
| So you're alright with a group of men "flexing their muscles" by stomping on a woman's head? |
Well first off it was not a group of men.
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Then you said "A group could be three or four men, that is not what I am disputing". Which is it?
This group also was not hired and trained as security, unlike the secret service example you gave.
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“In a modern...society, everybody has the absolute right to believe whatever they damn well please, but they don't have the same right to be taken seriously”.
-Barry Williams, co-founder, Australian Skeptics |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 10:42:09 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Fripp |
| Nice selective quoting. You conveniently left this out: |
Your saying I insulted you because I said skinny while you described yourself as very lean? That's weak, Buster, very weak.
| Since you keep pretending not to notice your response to a comment that was not directed at you, I'll post your response to me, again. |
Oh good grief! You posted on a public forum how you would love to confront some tea party kitties in person so you could show off some of your tough-man skills, being an ex-seal and all. I simply responded to your public post that hey let's make this interesting and up the challenge for you a little bit by putting on a tea party shirt and go confront the BP's. This was not a insult but just a suggestion that if your going to be an internet bad azz you might as well do it proper. Make sure and get this all on film and post it for us to see btw.
| You obviously take any criticism of any Teabagger very personally to have such a visceral response. But why do you keep avoiding explaining the attack? |
See above. No attack.
| BTW, why were so intimidated by those "big, bad" guys? They aren't very threatening. A billy club is useless in grappling range, and I doubt they've had any training on effective use of said club |
I wasn't intimidated. I just figured being the ex-seal you are and current internet bad azz they might be a little more worth your time then some hick tea partier.
| ... five males aren't a "group of men"? Bill, you're getting more and more ridiculous the deeper you dig yourself. |
I don't care if it was 20 men. They were justified in taking the gal to the ground. The guy with the sneaker I don't justify at all. That's the last time I will say this. If you can't grasp what I am saying now then nothing else I say will help you. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 11:04:07 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by podcat |
| Then you said "A group could be three or four men, that is not what I am disputing". Which is it? |
My point was that one man put his sneaker on the gals head and that is the whole stink here. The actions of one man. I don't care if it was 50 men that tackled the gal to the ground. That part of the confrontation I found totally justified.
| This group also was not hired and trained as security, unlike the secret service example you gave. |
So you are saying that Paul, the republican nominee for senator, makes public appearances without security or any type of entourage? Whether they have a diploma from security school or not is irrelevant. If so I would have a big problem with this if I were Paul. Who knows what nut cases are lurking in the crowds at these public events. With this weeks lurking nut case being a perfect case in point. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Fripp
SFN Regular
USA
727 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 11:31:50 [Permalink]
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Your saying I insulted you because I said skinny while you described yourself as very lean? That's weak, Buster, very weak. |
Yeah, that's why it took you ten responses, and numerous selective quote-mining to finally acknowledge what you did say.
Oh good grief! You posted on a public forum how you would love to confront some tea party kitties in person so you could show off some of your tough-man skills, being an ex-seal and all. I simply responded to your public post that hey let's make this interesting and up the challenge for you a little bit by putting on a tea party shirt and go confront the BP's. This was not a insult but just a suggestion that if your going to be an internet bad azz you might as well do it proper. Make sure and get this all on film and post it for us to see btw.
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Nice backpedalling. Oh yeah, of course it was I that COMPLETELY misinterpreted "skinny little ass" and whatever else you said as an intentional attack. But of course it isn't that you refuse to man up to them, but it's my fault that I'm too sensitive and you hurt my feelings.
I know where you're going to go now, so let me just nip it in the bud now. Trust me, I wasn't "ruffled" by your attacks. But if you're going to insult me unprovoked, do you expect me to just ignore it?
| I simply responded to your public post that hey let's make this interesting |
Please, give me a break.
I stand by my original post. I wanted to make it clear that they (the TeaBaggers) are very selective at who they pick on. I've seen it time and time again. My post obviously bothered you enough to write such an impassioned reply. Probably about as much as I was bothered by the shithead TeaBagger behavior.
But, I had then, and still have now, no interest in "showing off" may "bad ass" skills. I made that clear when I asked you to:
| I want you to post any previous examples where I have strutted around and talked tough. |
But exactly how stupid are you that when I do say...
| I want you to post any previous examples where I have strutted around and talked tough. |
...that you can't figure that I am talking about posts prior to my initial one in this thread?
But I'm sick of airing this little spat publicly. You won't admit to shit, and I don't care. I'm done with this part. Let's move on.
The guy with the sneaker I don't justify at all. That's the last time I will say this. If you can't grasp what I am saying now then nothing else I say will help you.
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It took you 4 pages until this admission was finally dragged out of you. Here's your first assessment on her treatment.
As someone who was in disguise and carrying an unidentified object who was trying to force her way over to a public figure making a public appearance who was surrounded by a security team, she got what she should have expected to get.
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"What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon?"
"Oh, I'm sorry. I thought my Dark Lord of the Sith could protect a small thermal exhaust port that's only 2-meters wide! That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! You have any idea what this is going to do to my credit?!?!"
"What? Oh, oh, 'just rebuild it'? Oh, real [bleep]ing original. And who's gonna give me a loan, jackhole? You? You got an ATM on that torso LiteBrite?" |
| Edited by - Fripp on 10/28/2010 11:46:45 |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 12:29:33 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
My point was that one man put his sneaker on the gals head and that is the whole stink here. The actions of one man. I don't care if it was 50 men that tackled the gal to the ground. That part of the confrontation I found totally justified. |
So titty-grabbing is ok by you? I'll remember that if I ever meet your wife.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 12:31:33 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Who knows what nut cases are lurking in the crowds at these public events.
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Pretty much everyone attending... 
But those weren't the ones you were thinking about, was it? |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 10/28/2010 : 12:55:14 [Permalink]
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Yeah, Bill, but what about that sorry sack of shit in the checked shirt copping a feel in the process? Hmm? The whole thing was an exercise in, and an excuse to, humiliate a woman.
The take-down was not justified at all. This woman had no weapon and made no threat. What I think is, that in a more secluded situation, it would have ended in gang rape. The "security guards" were, evidently, local hacks off the street, including Rand's Bourbon County coordinator, he of the mighty sneaker, and not paid staff -- it would be even worse if they were staff.
I sincerely hope they get everything the law can legitimately throw at them. They are cheap, school-yard bullies all growed up, and need to be given time to reflect upon their attitudes. Hard time.
And if Velle sues them, well, so much the better.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Really courageous, these teabaggers!
