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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  05:26:35  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A guide to changing your life written by Beck and a fuzzy thinking psychologist.

Dr Albow is quoted in the article as saying
The existence of one’s path—or destiny, if you will—is inexplicable and immeasurable and, as such, a kind of miracle. It has always and it will always defy scientific explanation. Finding it requires courage to begin looking for it, faith that it does indeed exist, a clear view of the wrong turns one has taken in life (i.e., truth) and an ability to forgive one self and others for those detours (i.e., compassion).



You know what happens when you follow paths that are inexplixable and immeasureable? You fall off a cliff!


Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  06:02:53   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Ebone4rock

A guide to changing your life written by Beck and a fuzzy thinking psychologist.

Dr Albow is quoted in the article as saying
The existence of one’s path—or destiny, if you will—is inexplicable and immeasurable and, as such, a kind of miracle. It has always and it will always defy scientific explanation. Finding it requires courage to begin looking for it, faith that it does indeed exist, a clear view of the wrong turns one has taken in life (i.e., truth) and an ability to forgive one self and others for those detours (i.e., compassion).



You know what happens when you follow paths that are inexplixable and immeasureable? You fall off a cliff!


This over-paid oaf is saying that science cannot study the suoernatural. No shit, Sherlock! How long, I wonder, did it take him to figure that out?
Dr. Keith Ablow is a psychiatrist and member of the Fox News Medical A-Team. He is a New York Times best-selling author, and co-author, with Glenn Beck, of the book "The 7: Seven Wonders That Will Change Your Life". Dr. Ablow can be reached at info@keithablow.com.

Ah, now all has been made clear!



Bolding mine.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

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Robb
SFN Regular

USA
1223 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  09:13:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Robb a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Beck is good at making money. That's all this seems to be.

What does this mean?

One’s true self is so powerful that trying to deny it creates emotional pain that we seek to cover up with alcohol and drugs, overeating, sexual addictions, compulsive gambling, a ceaseless quest for material goods, addiction to work and endless surfing on the Web.

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington
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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  09:29:02   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb

Beck is good at making money. That's all this seems to be.

What does this mean?

One’s true self is so powerful that trying to deny it creates emotional pain that we seek to cover up with alcohol and drugs, overeating, sexual addictions, compulsive gambling, a ceaseless quest for material goods, addiction to work and endless surfing on the Web.



I was trying to figure that one out too. Gibberish. If that were accurate then I should allow my true self to drink excessively, take drugs, and sleep with every woman I see because that is what my true self really wants to do. It takes a remarkable amount of self control to keep my shit straight!

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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Robb
SFN Regular

USA
1223 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  10:24:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Robb a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Ebone4rock

I was trying to figure that one out too. Gibberish. If that were accurate then I should allow my true self to drink excessively, take drugs, and sleep with every woman I see because that is what my true self really wants to do. It takes a remarkable amount of self control to keep my shit straight!
Exactly, he must think people are inherantly good. I think history shows different.

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  11:30:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb
Exactly, he must think people are inherantly good. I think history shows different.
Well, that's because the entire "people are inherently good/sinful" dichotomy is altogether wrong. Humans are a product of evolution, and our desires, instincts, impulses and inclinations only make sense in such a context. When one starts bringing magic into it and imagining life as a cosmic drama where everyone has a fated part to play, a true self or a "higher" purpose, one's explanations must necessarily be gibberish because they aren't accurate reflections of reality. Faith doesn't reveal truth, it obscures it.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
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Robb
SFN Regular

USA
1223 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  12:25:58   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Robb a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by H. Humbert

Well, that's because the entire "people are inherently good/sinful" dichotomy is altogether wrong. Humans are a product of evolution, and our desires, instincts, impulses and inclinations only make sense in such a context. When one starts bringing magic into it and imagining life as a cosmic drama where everyone has a fated part to play, a true self or a "higher" purpose, one's explanations must necessarily be gibberish because they aren't accurate reflections of reality. Faith doesn't reveal truth, it obscures it.
Why does people having a tendency toward doing bad things have anything to do with faith? I don’t have any studies but I do think that most people are tempted to do things in which our society thinks are bad such as lying, cheating etc. The reason they do not do these things in general is either pressure from society, personal philosophy or some religious beliefs they may have. Do you believe that society determines what is good and bad? Or is there no such thing as good and bad?

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  13:16:14   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb
Why does people having a tendency toward doing bad things have anything to do with faith?
It doesn't. I was commenting on the original conceit that "finding [one's true purpose] requires courage to begin looking for it and faith that it does indeed exist." But if you have to have "faith" in it for it to exist, then it isn't a truth to be found. It's a fiction created to mask the truth (i.e., that we have no cosmic purpose). Faith obscures the real reasons humanity is the way it is.

I don’t have any studies but I do think that most people are tempted to do things in which our society thinks are bad such as lying, cheating etc.
But we aren't tempted by some external force or agent. We simply have competing desires.

The reason they do not do these things in general is either pressure from society, personal philosophy or some religious beliefs they may have.
I don't think this is exactly true either. We do have an innate sense of morality. Most mentally healthy individuals have a conscience and experience emotions like shame and guilt that keep them from acting entirely selfishly. I think one of the most pervasive falsehoods concerning religion is that we need it to be good. I don't think that's true at all. Goodness, like our capacity for selfishness and cruelty, is innate.

Do you believe that society determines what is good and bad? Or is there no such thing as good and bad?
I don't believe there is any such thing as absolute good or bad. And certainly our moral sense is affected by the context of our cultures, religious beliefs, and the society in which we live. To use an analogy, I think our innate capacity for morality is like our innate capacity for language. We have brains that are primed for language, yet the specific dialect we speak is dependent upon the environment in which we are raised. And like feral children who are raised without any language at all and find that they cannot be taught to speak in adulthood, individuals who are mistreated during their developmental years often have their personal moral sense permanently impaired.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
Edited by - H. Humbert on 01/05/2011 13:24:35
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  13:32:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb

Beck is good at making money. That's all this seems to be.

What does this mean?
One’s true self is so powerful that trying to deny it creates emotional pain that we seek to cover up with alcohol and drugs, overeating, sexual addictions, compulsive gambling, a ceaseless quest for material goods, addiction to work and endless surfing on the Web.
Sounds like he's engaging in psychological projection. Or he's determined this truth with a sample that consisted of only Rush Limbaugh.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Ebone4rock
SFN Regular

USA
894 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  13:45:50   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Ebone4rock a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by Robb

Beck is good at making money. That's all this seems to be.

What does this mean?
One’s true self is so powerful that trying to deny it creates emotional pain that we seek to cover up with alcohol and drugs, overeating, sexual addictions, compulsive gambling, a ceaseless quest for material goods, addiction to work and endless surfing on the Web.
Sounds like he's engaging in psychological projection. Or he's determined this truth with a sample that consisted of only Rush Limbaugh.


I'd really like to know how a person can determine what "one's true self" is.

After reading this paragraph a number of times it seems to me that he may be trying to describe cognitive dissonance.

Haole with heart, thats all I'll ever be. I'm not a part of the North Shore society. Stuck on the shoulder, that's where you'll find me. Digging for scraps with the kooks in line. -Offspring
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moakley
SFN Regular

USA
1888 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  14:25:38   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send moakley a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb

Beck is good at making money. That's all this seems to be.

What does this mean?

One’s true self is so powerful that trying to deny it creates emotional pain that we seek to cover up with alcohol and drugs, overeating, sexual addictions, compulsive gambling, a ceaseless quest for material goods, addiction to work and endless surfing on the Web.

That's a good question. And I agree with your Beck comment.

I wonder if the book explains how we recognize when we are on the "correct path" since we each have a "correct path" that we should be on. Or even that the "correct path" is as varied as all individuals. Or will it just be more pablum for the masses, as already suggested in this thread, since he states that embracing God is a part of the "correct path".

Life is good

Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous
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Robb
SFN Regular

USA
1223 Posts

Posted - 01/05/2011 :  18:37:59   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Robb a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by H. Humbert

I don't think this is exactly true either. We do have an innate sense of morality. Most mentally healthy individuals have a conscience and experience emotions like shame and guilt that keep them from acting entirely selfishly. I think one of the most pervasive falsehoods concerning religion is that we need it to be good. I don't think that's true at all. Goodness, like our capacity for selfishness and cruelty, is innate.
Does that shame or guilt come from inside oneself or from external sources? Or can we know?

You don't need religion to be good, I agree. But don't you need a basis for what is good and bad?

*preaching mode*
Jesus did not come so we will be good, but that our sins will be forgiven.
*preaching mode off*

I don't believe there is any such thing as absolute good or bad. And certainly our moral sense is affected by the context of our cultures, religious beliefs, and the society in which we live. To use an analogy, I think our innate capacity for morality is like our innate capacity for language. We have brains that are primed for language, yet the specific dialect we speak is dependent upon the environment in which we are raised. And like feral children who are raised without any language at all and find that they cannot be taught to speak in adulthood, individuals who are mistreated during their developmental years often have their personal moral sense permanently impaired.
So then how can we as a society punish people that have a different sense of right and wrong?

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington
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Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 01/06/2011 :  00:00:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Robb

Originally posted by H. Humbert

I don't think this is exactly true either. We do have an innate sense of morality. Most mentally healthy individuals have a conscience and experience emotions like shame and guilt that keep them from acting entirely selfishly. I think one of the most pervasive falsehoods concerning religion is that we need it to be good. I don't think that's true at all. Goodness, like our capacity for selfishness and cruelty, is innate.
Does that shame or guilt come from inside oneself or from external sources? Or can we know?

You don't need religion to be good, I agree. But don't you need a basis for what is good and bad?

*preaching mode*
Jesus did not come so we will be good, but that our sins will be forgiven.
*preaching mode off*

I don't believe there is any such thing as absolute good or bad. And certainly our moral sense is affected by the context of our cultures, religious beliefs, and the society in which we live. To use an analogy, I think our innate capacity for morality is like our innate capacity for language. We have brains that are primed for language, yet the specific dialect we speak is dependent upon the environment in which we are raised. And like feral children who are raised without any language at all and find that they cannot be taught to speak in adulthood, individuals who are mistreated during their developmental years often have their personal moral sense permanently impaired.
So then how can we as a society punish people that have a different sense of right and wrong?

By basing our rules on evidence and fact. It is provable that everyone in a community is better off if it is against the rules to kill, rape, steal, etc. Problems arise only when we start making rules that can't be justified with evidence, like making gay marriage illegal or banning all abortions.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
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