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 Creationist Rape Apologetics with John Mackay
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the_ignored
SFN Addict

2557 Posts

Posted - 01/08/2014 :  18:29:17  Show Profile Send the_ignored a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Here you go:


In a conversation about the Bible after the lecture, a student pointed out that the Bible condones rape in the following passage from Numbers 31:

“17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that has known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.”

Mackay argued that this is not rape, because the girls were forced to enter a “legitimate Jewish marriage” first (after having their family murdered by their soon-to-be husbands), and obviously you can’t rape your own wife. Not only is it not rape, but Mackay believes this is apparently not even immoral for God to command this and for the Israelites to carry it out.


And it goes on, with a link to MacKay's website (see article) and more:

"This goes further than an opinion about the Bible. Mackay sincerely believes that even today, rape within marriage is a contradiction, and that forced marriage can be legitimate. The idea that rape is wrong is apparently a recent secular invention."


They quote MacKay here:
“The modern atheist mind wants to use modern their [sic] definition of rape as an absolute, such that a woman both before and after marriage is an autonomous being who has rights to resist any man including the man she married, and if he insists on sex, then that is rape and the male is legally guilty of a crime.”"

Uh, aren't those people the ones who pretend to have "absolute morality"?

>From: enuffenuff@fastmail.fm
(excerpt follows):
> I'm looking to teach these two bastards a lesson they'll never forget.
> Personal visit by mates of mine. No violence, just a wee little chat.
>
> **** has also committed more crimes than you can count with his
> incitement of hatred against a religion. That law came in about 2007
> much to ****'s ignorance. That is fact and his writing will become well
> know as well as him becoming a publicly known icon of hatred.
>
> Good luck with that fuckwit. And Reynold, fucking run, and don't stop.
> Disappear would be best as it was you who dared to attack me on my
> illness knowing nothing of the cause. You disgust me and you are top of
> the list boy. Again, no violence. Just regular reminders of who's there
> and visits to see you are behaving. Nothing scary in reality. But I'd
> still disappear if I was you.

What brought that on? this. Original posting here.

Another example of this guy's lunacy here.

On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

Saudi Arabia
1266 Posts

Posted - 01/08/2014 :  22:17:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Someone needs to remind him that it was not an atheist movement that pushed through marital rape laws.

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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26009 Posts

Posted - 01/09/2014 :  12:56:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by the_ignored

Uh, aren't those people the ones who pretend to have "absolute morality"?
Yeah, they're saying it's absolutely okay to rape your wife.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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sailingsoul
SFN Addict

2830 Posts

Posted - 01/09/2014 :  19:42:15   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sailingsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Yeah, they're saying it's absolutely okay to rape your wife.
According to the Bible women are property or should be effectively treated as such. Absolutely wives are NOT equal to the man of the household according to the Bible and should submit to her husband. If I didn't understand the immorality with that belief it would be a good thing for me to get my morals from the Bible now wouldn't it.

I'm not saying everything in the Bible is immoral. I saying where there is morality in the Bible it is moral because it is moral, not because it is in the Bible and where there is immorality in the Bible it is not moral because it's in the Bible. So much for getting one's moral guidance from a Book written by bronze age goat herders. I've read the Bible is a collection of fairytales written by illiterate goat herders back in the Bronze Age (Link) but if they were 'illiterate' there wouldn't be a problem today would there?

There are only two types of religious people, the deceivers and the deceived. SS
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sailingsoul
SFN Addict

2830 Posts

Posted - 01/09/2014 :  20:07:11   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sailingsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

Someone needs to remind him that it was not an atheist movement that pushed through marital rape laws.
What exactly does that mean? Why don't you explain what that means for some of the slow people here who need a guide book for teaching them morality? Maybe someone should remind you that it was not an Atheist movement that fought pushing through marital rape laws.

There are only two types of religious people, the deceivers and the deceived. SS
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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

Saudi Arabia
1266 Posts

Posted - 01/11/2014 :  03:47:55   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think it's pretty clear what it means. Clear enough for any lamb or small child to understand, but not you evidently.

Usually I don't explain myself if I believe my meaning is clear but I will do so for you on this occasion. This guy Mackay seems to be implying that only Atheists believe marital rape is a crime. He says as much with the 3rd quote in the original post. He's trying to turn the issue of marital rape into a Christian Vs Atheist one, when it just isn't. Thus, I spake; "Someone needs to remind him that it was not an atheist movement that pushed through marital rape laws." Rather it was a movement with no single religious or political allegiance.

Maybe you're so concerned about posting belligerent replies to each and everyone one of my comments (no matter how innocuous) that you fail to consider the meaning. Perhaps you should attempt to read posts as if they are anonymous, before you attempt to formulate meanings in your mind. It might help you circumvent your brain's prejudice and prejudging tenancies.

What exactly does that mean? Why don't you explain what that means for some of the slow people here who need a guide book for teaching them morality?


You also seem to be confused with your sarcasm. If you don't understand and you're saying and I need to explain for slow people who need a book for morality, you are putting yourself in that group. You're lumping yourself in with people you are trying to insult.

Edited by - On fire for Christ on 01/11/2014 03:51:05
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sailingsoul
SFN Addict

2830 Posts

Posted - 01/11/2014 :  14:42:09   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sailingsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ


Maybe you're so concerned about posting belligerent replies to each and everyone one of my comments (no matter how innocuous) that you fail to consider the meaning. Perhaps you should attempt to read posts as if they are anonymous, before you attempt to formulate meanings in your mind. It might help you circumvent your brain's prejudice and prejudging tenancies.
I'll do that in the future, a kind of New Years resolution. Any further comment right now would undoubtedly be interpreted by you as immediately failing right out of the gate.

There are only two types of religious people, the deceivers and the deceived. SS
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welshdean
Skeptic Friend

United Kingdom
172 Posts

Posted - 02/19/2014 :  12:35:36   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send welshdean a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

I think it's pretty clear what it means. Clear enough for any lamb or small child to understand, but not you evidently.

Usually I don't explain myself if I believe my meaning is clear but I will do so for you on this occasion. This guy Mackay seems to be implying that only Atheists believe marital rape is a crime. He says as much with the 3rd quote in the original post. He's trying to turn the issue of marital rape into a Christian Vs Atheist one, when it just isn't. Thus, I spake; "Someone needs to remind him that it was not an atheist movement that pushed through marital rape laws." Rather it was a movement with no single religious or political allegiance.

Maybe you're so concerned about posting belligerent replies to each and everyone one of my comments (no matter how innocuous) that you fail to consider the meaning. Perhaps you should attempt to read posts as if they are anonymous, before you attempt to formulate meanings in your mind. It might help you circumvent your brain's prejudice and prejudging tenancies.

What exactly does that mean? Why don't you explain what that means for some of the slow people here who need a guide book for teaching them morality?


You also seem to be confused with your sarcasm. If you don't understand and you're saying and I need to explain for slow people who need a book for morality, you are putting yourself in that group. You're lumping yourself in with people you are trying to insult.


You are a lovely little thing aren't you!

Self aggrandise much?

"Frazier is so ugly he should donate his face to the US Bureau of Wild Life."

"I am America. I am the part you won't recognize, but get used to me. Black, confident, cocky. My name, not yours. My religion, not yours. My goals, my own. Get used to me."

"Service to others is the rent you pay for your room here on earth."

---- Muhammad Ali


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On fire for Christ
SFN Regular

Saudi Arabia
1266 Posts

Posted - 02/20/2014 :  00:13:18   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send On fire for Christ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by welshdean



You are a lovely little thing aren't you!

Self aggrandise much?


Yeah I'm the bad guy for meeting hostility head on.

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The Rat
SFN Regular

Canada
1342 Posts

Posted - 02/21/2014 :  05:55:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit The Rat's Homepage Send The Rat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by On fire for Christ

Someone needs to remind him that it was not an atheist movement that pushed through marital rape laws.


I agree, but you completely obscure the point, which is that there are still some backward theocratic ASSHOLES who believe this shit is perfectly okay. And they aren't atheists.


Bailey's second law; There is no relationship between the three virtues of intelligence, education, and wisdom.

You fiend! Never have I encountered such corrupt and foul-minded perversity! Have you ever considered a career in the Church? - The Bishop of Bath and Wells, Blackadder II

Baculum's page: http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=3947338590
Edited by - The Rat on 02/21/2014 05:56:58
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