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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
 Posted - 07/20/2007 : 14:53:49 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
The honesty is refreshing. “Scientist” do not have a strangle hold on truth. |
No, but they have a stranglehold on the only method of uncovering truth. There is no other game in town. Your options for finding truth are science or science.
| Many times they are wrong, and those defending their science are, therefore, defending that which is not true. |
They are defending the best answer available at any given time. These answers are only ever replaced by better answers which get us closer to the truth.
| The beauty of this is that scientists correct themselves, or are corrected by other scientists. |
100% of the time? Say no. Therefore that which is not true is passed along as truth, under the banner of “science.” |
Right, but that isn't a valid reason for dismissing any science you choose. You need to have evidence to backup your accusations of falsehood, otherwise your suspicions are rejected on the grounds of being grossly prejudiced and unreasonable.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 07/20/2007 : 15:17:16 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Originally posted by filthy
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| Scientists get it wrong all the time. |
The honesty is refreshing. “Scientist” do not have a strangle hold on truth. Many times they are wrong, and those defending their science are, therefore, defending that which is not true.
| The beauty of this is that scientists correct themselves, or are corrected by other scientists. |
100% of the time? Say no. Therefore that which is not true is passed along as truth, under the banner of “science.”
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Yes Bill, every single time up to and including abandoning the research as a failure. There is little to be gained for the scientist or for the layman from incorrect hypothesis, and very little gets past scientific peer review.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 15:19:36 [Permalink]
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| "Creationism is not a scientific alternative to natural selection any more than the stork theory is an alternative to sexual reproduction." — Hayes |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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Chippewa
SFN Regular
USA
1496 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 16:00:27 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Whatever the scientists say, they can't be wrong. Just get a consensus and mix it in with a theory and *poof* you've now got empirical. Love how that science works. |
Oh my, did you see the look in Jerome's eyes? The right gnome finally came along. 
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Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.
"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.) |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 16:08:58 [Permalink]
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Yup, you can't go wrong with Bill, Jerome. He knows.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 18:12:20 [Permalink]
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| There is nothing higher, or better, than a theory. |
From the link.
This is an amusing statement. When did this recent new description of science "theory" come about?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 18:56:57 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
| There is nothing higher, or better, than a theory. |
From the link.
This is an amusing statement. When did this recent new description of science "theory" come about? |
A few hundred years ago. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 19:00:52 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
| There is nothing higher, or better, than a theory. |
From the link.
This is an amusing statement. When did this recent new description of science "theory" come about?
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About the same time as science.....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 20:49:48 [Permalink]
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Newspeak.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:04:08 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Newspeak.
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Doublethink.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 07/20/2007 21:07:41 |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:06:09 [Permalink]
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NEWSPEAK: a language "designed to diminish the range of thought
: propagandistic language marked by euphemism, circumlocution, and the inversion of customary meanings |
THEORY:An unproven conjecture.
THEORY:A coherent statement that attempts to explain observed phenomena.
Wikionary
Notice how the customary meaning is inversed?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:08:40 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by HalfMooner
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Newspeak.
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Doublethink.
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No, doublethink is the holding of simultaneous belief in two contradictory ideas.
An example would be: evolution is a fact and a theory.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:15:45 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
NEWSPEAK: a language "designed to diminish the range of thought
: propagandistic language marked by euphemism, circumlocution, and the inversion of customary meanings |
THEORY:An unproven conjecture.
THEORY:A coherent statement that attempts to explain observed phenomena.
Wikionary
Notice how the customary meaning is inversed?
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But, as has been repeatedly pointed out to you, what you call the "customary," (really, the "casual") definition of "theory," and its scientific use, have been divergent for centuries. You just refuse to accept science's own careful definition in its use of the term. That's your cognitive problem, not science's.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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ktesibios
SFN Regular
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:17:43 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Newspeak.
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Horsepuckey. That the definition of a technical term isn't identical to the definition of the same word in common usage doesn't mean that the technical usage is deceptive. It means that interpreting the technical term by the standards of common usage is incorrect.
This can also happen when the same word is used as a term of art in two different disciplines. For example, when I first started reading the Bad Astronomy forum (now the BAUT forum) and the Apollohoax forum, I found it very hard to understand JayUtah's use of the term "phase angle" in discussing Apollo photographs.
The problem was that I'm an electronics tech by trade, "phase angle" has a specific meaning in electronics and I was instinctively applying that meaning to the term. It wasn't until I grasped that "phase angle" has a very different meaning when you're discussing lighting that I was able to understand what Jay was saying. |
"The Republican agenda is to turn the United States into a third-world shithole." -P.Z.Myers |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2007 : 21:22:47 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Originally posted by HalfMooner
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Newspeak.
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Doublethink.
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No, doublethink is the holding of simultaneous belief in two contradictory ideas.
An example would be: evolution is a fact and a theory.
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Still trolling along with that nonsense?
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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www.notjustatheory.com
Topic Locked
