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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  08:12:07  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One thing that has always annoyed me is the holier than thou nature of the wine connoisseur sect(most of em). I don't care how old or rare a bottle of wine is it is never going to be delicious, wine is and always will be a means to an end. This whole industry is nothing more than a way of kidding yourself into thinking that you are not just an alcoholic, you're more refined than a beer drinker or have some special gift that others lack. Really all you are doing is conning yourself into paying an extreme amount of money for something that you could get for a few bucks, drunk. Then theres the whole wine with food joke, where this wine or that wine will cleanse the palet or 'bring out the nutty flavor in your overpriced meal', give me a break.

Drink a shot and grab a coke, spare me the rest. [/rant]

Oh and fuck France.

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini

Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  08:41:18   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'll respectfully disagree, but only just a little. In grad school, I worked part time at a liquor store. In addition to making some extra cash to live on, this had the added benefit of supporting my alcohol habit at a discount. Anyhow, working there, I had the chance to try lots of wines. Probably thousands. The best part of the job was when the wine rep came in to peddle whatever the distributor was trying to move that week. She or he would come in with 5 or 6 different bottles to sample. Once you'd been at the store for awhile, the boss would have you sit in on the tasting, too.

I learned a great deal about wine, and in many (but not most!) cases, there is a difference between a $10 bottle and a $20 bottle, and between a $20 bottle and a $50 bottle. Somewhere along the way, that distinction grows less, and I would never say that a $100 was twice the value of a $50 bottle. At least, not the once I sampled.

Having said that, I always thought wine was worth it since I wasn't paying retail. A bottle at retail is usually priced at about 50% over wholesale (so the store bought it at $6.66 and sells it for $9.99). I usually payed 10% over cost. So that $20 bottle was "worth it" because I paid no where close to $20. Now that I'm out of the wine store business, I find that when I buy wine, it's more like the $8 or $9 bottles, and not $20 bottle, that I'm getting.

People (well, some of them) are snooty about their liquor, too. And while I would say that top shelf bourbon is better than the Evan Williams that I buy, I think I'll keep my cheap stuff and mix it with some Coke or Sprite and be plenty happy about it.
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard

3192 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  08:47:28   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send BigPapaSmurf a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh dont get me wrong, I have no issues with cheap wine and I realise that some wines are clearly better than others. Its the attitude and elitist crap that grates me.

"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History

"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini
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Robb
SFN Regular

USA
1223 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  10:18:36   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Robb a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In the mall you cannot walk 3 feet without someone trying to rub some kind of cologne or perfume on you. That bugs me.

Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington
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Risendemonx
New Member

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  10:40:23   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Risendemonx a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd have to agree with Cuneiformist here as well. Although I have not had enough "fine" wines to really tell, I do have my favorite kinds. I also do understand the "certain wines with certain dishes" thing. For me, I much prefer red wine with red meat, and white with white- I find that cooking with wine will bring out certain tastes as well- Just like having pancakes with butter and Surup, or with penutbutter and jelly. Maybe it doesn't bring out different flavors, so much as it blends better with the existing flavors, I don't know.

However, I do draw the line with the elitist stuff- My dad recieved a $250 bottle of wine for his birthday last year, and I tried it. While my sample space was one expensive bottle, it didn't taste any better than a $30 bottle, imho

Of course, there are exceptions to the rule, and I think that exception is hard liquour. I notice that aging a whisky for a few more years makes volumes of difference with its taste!

"In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally considered to have been a bad move."
--
Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9677 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  12:39:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've found that there's Whiskey, and then there's Islay Whisky. Notably: Bowmoore and Laphroaig. I haven't tried Lagavulin.

There is a distinct difference between wines too, but I agree that the "wine connoisseur sect" mostly seems to be like most other extremists: holier than thou. But wine tasters seems to be less violent than say... religious extremists.

Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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Risendemonx
New Member

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  12:49:07   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Risendemonx a Private Message  Reply with Quote
read up on them- the sound good!

Well, this topic is making me look forward to this evening. I think I know what i'm going to be doing tonight!







and in that order!

"In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally considered to have been a bad move."
--
Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4954 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  13:38:34   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Risendemonx

read up on them- the sound good!

Well, this topic is making me look forward to this evening. I think I know what i'm going to be doing tonight!







and in that order!
Ha! The SFN stages of drunkenness! As long as there's no you should be OK.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26009 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  13:53:31   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Cuneiformist

As long as there's no you should be OK.
And if you get to the stage, you're doing it wrong.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Chippewa
SFN Regular

USA
1496 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  18:31:44   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Chippewa's Homepage Send Chippewa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't know where all these "wine snobs" are some here are talking about. I'm sure there are some silly "wine snobs" out there but I don't know them and there are after all, snobs in practically every area.

All the wine lovers I know are fun-loving folks who like good food, great music (in many styles,) art, movies, and interesting conversation. Some might define that as snobbery if they themselves dislike those things or even embrace the opposite.

Some folks I know who appreciate good wine are classical, blues and Americana musicians. One is a lawyer and the other a published author (both more toward beer than wine) and several artists. One wine-loving artist does projects with people in prisons, and another does art projects with handicapped kids. Another is a visual artist and a direct descendant of the Russian composer Alexander Glazunov - which I only mention because its interesting. My girlfriend and I have our basic wine likes and dislikes but we're not experts. We know a rather hip wine expert at the local market. He worked for years as a wine rep and doesn't have any snob characteristics.

The few French people that I know are basically nice and run counter to the right-wing NeoCon "freedom fries" image that Bush supporters embraced. In fact even before Sarkozy, bad mouthing "the French" across the board was becoming (to coin a phrase) passe. (Except for the boneheads on FauxNews.)

Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.

"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.)
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  18:37:02   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Originally posted by Cuneiformist

As long as there's no you should be OK.
And if you get to the stage, you're doing it wrong.
And stay away from unless you want to find yourself .

"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard

USA
4907 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  19:20:21   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Ricky an AOL message Send Ricky a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I agree with BPS's post, but to a much greater extent. What he said applies to all foods. Now granted, ground beef will never taste like fillet mignon. However, many people are so particular about the food they buy, when in reality there is little if any discernible difference. And even if there is a difference, it's not that one is better than the other, it's just that they are in fact different.

Penn and Teller had and episode of Bullshit to this effect: The Best.

Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov
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Hawks
SFN Regular

Canada
1383 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  19:39:37   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Hawks's Homepage Send Hawks a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A lot of things bug me; I suppose it comes with getting older...

Anyhow, one of my pet-peeves is sodomist drivers.

...

That's tailgating, btw.

METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden!
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard

USA
4574 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  19:42:52   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send H. Humbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I dislike procrastin-eaters. Those are people who eat slowly in restaurants.


"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman

"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13463 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  20:27:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't understand why my cell phone must have ten thousand features that I will never use. I just want a phone that works--as--you know, a phone...

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26009 Posts

Posted - 12/21/2007 :  22:08:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
But Kil, those other features are so helpful.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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