Skeptic Friends Network

Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?
Home | Forums | Active Topics | Active Polls | Register | FAQ | Contact Us  
  Connect: Chat | SFN Messenger | Buddy List | Members
Personalize: Profile | My Page | Forum Bookmarks  
 All Forums
 Our Skeptic Forums
 Politics
 Obama/Biden 2008
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 08/22/2008 :  22:51:01  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message  Reply with Quote
At least, that is the way NBC is reporting it at 1am.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth

Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 08/22/2008 :  22:58:53   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sheesh. Reading that article all I could think was, "Republicans win in 2008."

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
Go to Top of Page

@tomic
Administrator

USA
4607 Posts

Posted - 08/22/2008 :  23:05:48   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit @tomic's Homepage Send @tomic a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've been thinking the Biden talk was subterfuge. We'll see. There are a few hours until it's official.

@

Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!

Sportsbettingacumen.com: The science of sports betting
Go to Top of Page

Chippewa
SFN Regular

USA
1496 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  03:29:28   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Chippewa's Homepage Send Chippewa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think behind the scenes, the Republicans are really nervous about this. Terrified in fact. The McCain camp's early criticism not withstanding. To me, Biden is a top-notch choice.

Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.

"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.)
Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  05:16:27   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I dunno. I've not had much in-depth info on Biden. This will change...

When I heard he was the nominee, I immeditally went to Freep City to see how they are reacting. They don't seem to have a lot to say about it beyond the standard booshwah. That too, will change as they get their dysenteric shit together.

You can learn a lot from from the Freepers, but right now, they seem to be ing Hallmark for producing greeting cards themed to gay marriage. They do them some homersexurals as well.

It should get better later today.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13467 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  06:40:52   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, I was hoping it would be Biden. So this ticket works for me...

And by the way, Biden's negative remarks about Obama were made while Biden was running against him. Also, Obama has said he want's someone who will challenge his idea's and not simply be a yes man. So this early attack will fade. The fact is, Biden brings balance and he will debate all Republican comers under the table...

As for his insiderness, hell, you can't win for loosing. They attack Obama for not being seasoned enough, then attack him for choosing someone who is very well seasoned and knows how to work Washington.

He is scrappy and smart. His personality may offset Obama's reserved style and should make blue collar democrats more comfortable.

And lets face it. The McCain camp was going to attack anyone Obama chose. Big deal...

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
Go to Top of Page

Dude
SFN Die Hard

USA
6891 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  08:33:10   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Dude a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, McCain was going to unleash the attack dogs on anyone Obama picked. Biden, at least, is one of those capable of defending himself vigorously, and he is a seasoned speaker as well.

Personally I'd have liked to see him go with Bloomberg or Hagel, but I'm not unhappy with Biden.


Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson

"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin

Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth
Go to Top of Page

bngbuck
SFN Addict

USA
2437 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  10:36:22   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send bngbuck a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In an America transformed (in a damn unfortunate way) by Vice President Dick Cheney, Joe Biden is by far the best choice to counter McCain's attacks on Obama's foreign policy experience. This country is inured to a VP more powerful and influential than the president. Bush has been Cheney's poodle. Obama will need to show that he is indeed his own man, but because he is and is an orator, I don't see this as a problem.

Suddenly, McCain's touted "foreign policy experience" pales in comparison to a real foreign policy guru - one who will undoubtedly have a strong voice in government. No one in the Replugs can match his credentials. And he can talk like a goosed mynah bird - yeah, too much, but he is getting friendlier with the period; witness his terse "yes", a highlight in the nomination debates.

Best of all, his Gatling gun verbosity can be disciplined to shred this "only McCain can save us from the Cossacks" bullshit that Rove and friends have been feverishly pumping recently. He provides exactly what Obama needs right now, a political junkyard dog to projectile hurl the Republican vomit right back, doubled in spades (that sentence may set a new standard for simplistic similes in a single sentence!)

Obama and Biden will have to beware the dreaded Gaffegate, but frequent attacks of toe-in-mouth disease have not seemed to cripple Biden much. He is as much fun to listen to as Bill Maher.

He's a Catholic, probably a real political asset, it gives me pause as all religious delusionaries do, but what the hell; my wife believes in some kind of god of the vapors and, as long as we don't discuss it more than twice a day, we get along just fine!

I actually feel sorry for whoever he faces down on October 8th at the VP debates in St. Louis. This guy would bore a widescreen porthole in William Jennings Bryan exactly as Clarence Darrow did with:
"You have given considerable study to the Bible, haven't you, Mr. Bryan?" "Yes, sir; I have tried to ... But, of course, I have studied it more as I have become older than when I was a boy." "Do you claim then that everything in the Bible should be literally interpreted?" "I believe that everything in the Bible should be accepted as it is given there; some of the Bible is given illustratively. For instance: "Ye are the salt of the earth." I would not insist that man was actually salt, or that he had flesh of salt, but it is used in the sense of salt as saving God's people."
In my view, the only smudge that Biden carries is his wonderwimp performance during the Clarence Thomas confirmation hearings in 1991.

I watched every minute of that drama on TV, and I have no doubt that Biden, then chair of the judiciary committee, could have blocked the nomination by allowing Angela Wright's testimony to confirm that of Anita Hill. He caved to his perception of the political PC of the moment, and we ended up with the second worse SCOTUS justice in history. (Scalia takes top prize in this category)
Edited by - bngbuck on 08/23/2008 10:40:56
Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  12:02:57   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well said, Buck. I haven't had much time today (preparing to move) but have scratched around a little -- enough to, thus far, agree.

I am truly looking forward to the debates; the best orator we've seen for lo, these many years partnered with the dude with the blade in his boot.

I don't wonder that McCain has gotten off an attack ad before the echo of the announcement died away.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2008 :  12:31:13   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Rude Pundit has some thoughts on the matter:
8/23/2008
A Word or Two Regarding Joe Biden:
Still in an ouzo haze (thanks, Talia), but here's a couple of observations from when the phone vibrated at 3 a.m.:
His points are well enough taken I think, ouzo hangover or not -- I like licorice but never cared for ouzo.




"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

Go to Top of Page

marfknox
SFN Die Hard

USA
3739 Posts

Posted - 08/24/2008 :  23:21:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit marfknox's Homepage  Send marfknox an AOL message Send marfknox a Private Message  Reply with Quote
At a party last night some people said that Biden was a terrible choice based purely on the fact that when his last name is put next to Obama it resembles Osama bin Laden. Do a Google search for those three names and stumble on all sorts of crazy nonsense on forums, such as this:

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message592430/pg1

Full of idiotic posts like this:

this demonstrates the karmic connection bet. all powers of the world. Bin Laden, George Bush, Obama, biden, etc... they are all karmically connected.


Do people go down such moronic lines of thinking because they are too lazy to bother leaning about the candidates, or because it is just that much more fun to make crazy shit up? Perhaps both?


"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong

Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com

Edited by - marfknox on 08/24/2008 23:22:07
Go to Top of Page

marfknox
SFN Die Hard

USA
3739 Posts

Posted - 08/24/2008 :  23:23:50   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit marfknox's Homepage  Send marfknox an AOL message Send marfknox a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I like Kil's point, though Biden wasn't my first choice. I liked Bill Richardson, and even Clinton before Biden.

Then again, I was going to vote for Edwards until he dropped out of the race before it came to PA, so maybe my judgment isn't worth a damn.


"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong

Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com

Go to Top of Page

bngbuck
SFN Addict

USA
2437 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2008 :  14:41:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send bngbuck a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Marfknox.....

Then again, I was going to vote for Edwards until he dropped out of the race before it came to PA, so maybe my judgment isn't worth a damn.
Hell, Marf, he's just another philandering politcian with a prepuce-in-the zipper problem. Probably would have made a damn good president. I don't hold his raging testosterone against him any more than I do Clinton's uncontrollable hare-brained excesses!
Go to Top of Page

Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26012 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2008 :  10:02:33   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm not sure that it matters how good a pick Biden is. Looks more and more like the Democratic Party has turned into the party of self-destruction, being relatively ineffectual in Congress and undermining the party platform in favor of religious inclusivity. The person running the convention has apparently said that the Democrats are a party of faith. I hear that half of Obama's 2% drop in the polls over the last two months is due to an 8% drop in secular voters' support. And what with many of Hillary's supporters still not giving up, there's a schism in the works, anyway.

If things keep on going as they have been, Obama won't be electable and McCain will win, no matter how much "lesser of two evils" voting is going on, because there simply won't be enough party support. In other words, unlike in 2000, all votes against McCain will be "wasted." And if that looks like it's happening, then those no reason for independents to not vote their conscience for some third party or other, although I couldn't begin to say who looks like a decent choice.

It'd be interesting if there were a not-theocratic candidate that all secularists (and even anti-theocratic theists) could get behind to make a good showing on Election Day. Getting even five percent might wake some people up.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
Go to Top of Page

Simon
SFN Regular

USA
1992 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2008 :  10:39:30   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Simon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I am not sure that the secularist are so numerous as to have a very big impact. Especially, as I suspect that a large proportion of them would consider such a statement as a necessary cosmetic effort and would not keep a grudge on Obama for such a statement; especially considering the alternative.

But, certainly, I am getting nervous.

Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996
Go to Top of Page

bngbuck
SFN Addict

USA
2437 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2008 :  10:48:58   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send bngbuck a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Dave....


Looks more and more like the Democratic Party has turned into the party of self-destruction, being relatively ineffectual in Congress and undermining the party platform in favor of religious inclusivity. If things keep on going as they have been, Obama won't be electable and McCain will win, no matter how much "lesser of two evils" voting is going on, because there simply won't be enough party support.


Yeah, terribly unfortunately, you're right! The very diversity and acceptance of color, race, ethnicity, sexual preference, etc. that differentiates the Democrats from the Republicans to a great degree; is ripping them asunder internally. This stupidity of fanatic Hillary supporters voting for McCain (or not voting, which is the same thing) is absolutely infuriating! Such political blindness is almost incomprehensible to me!

History repeats itself endlessly. Once again, the Democrats are totally fucking up a gift fron the gods - an almost unbelievable one-time opportunity to set things right - with childish internal squabbling and ego trips, every faction having to have it's own way!

When it comes down to how to promote themselves politically, the Republicans are really much smarter than are the Democrats!

In other words, unlike in 2000, all votes against McCain will be "wasted." And if that looks like it's happening, then those no reason for independents to not vote their conscience for some third party or other, although I couldn't begin to say who looks like a decent choice.
If the polls show a really strong McCain lead in late October, Nader would probably be the only (really lousy) choice to make a statement. Let's face it, a thinking person would have to be totally convinced that Obama was going to lose - really, really certain - in order to sorrowfully commit a protest vote!

Well, I live only ninety miles from Canada........!

I'm thinking about buying a summer home in Banff! Great mall up there, too!
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly Bookmark this Topic BookMark Topic
Jump To:

The mission of the Skeptic Friends Network is to promote skepticism, critical thinking, science and logic as the best methods for evaluating all claims of fact, and we invite active participation by our members to create a skeptical community with a wide variety of viewpoints and expertise.


Home | Skeptic Forums | Skeptic Summary | The Kil Report | Creation/Evolution | Rationally Speaking | Skeptillaneous | About Skepticism | Fan Mail | Claims List | Calendar & Events | Skeptic Links | Book Reviews | Gift Shop | SFN on Facebook | Staff | Contact Us

Skeptic Friends Network
© 2008 Skeptic Friends Network Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.3 seconds.
Powered by @tomic Studio
Snitz Forums 2000