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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
 Posted - 02/19/2008 : 13:29:48 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by HalfMooner
I imagine that we may someday find other such remarkable examples of ancient knowledge and skill. |
When it is argued that ancient people had help from aliens/God/whomever in constructing this device (or the pyramids, or Stonehenge), the common implicit argument is that the ancient people were too stupid to have done it themselves. Do we now know more than the ancient Greeks? Sure. Are we smarter than they were on average? No evidence of that. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2008 : 14:58:46 [Permalink]
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Regarding the "Planetary Computer": It is a remarkable piece of mechanic.
Very early, the Chineese recorded astronomical events. I think the first recorded solar eclipse was made around 2000 BCE. Once they started to regularily record eclipses in the 14th century BCE, they should have been able to start predicting eclipses too. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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freewest4ever
New Member
United Kingdom
6 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 08:31:32 [Permalink]
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You guys are still posting on this rubbish? Well, if you need proof that the modern Ethiopo-"Greeks" are killing and murdering Macedonians, just watch the NEWS these days! See what they are doing! STEALING OUR HISTORY! And they are supported by brainwashed people like YOU!
Shame on you all... I hold you all accountable for the situation in which my country is now. Our land has been stolen. Our people have been killed. We are not even allowed our own name. |
Stop the Lies.
Free Macedonia |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 08:47:10 [Permalink]
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| Fyi jackass, it was somebody elses homeland before your people came along, get over your very deluded self. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 09:07:16 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by freewest4ever
You guys are still posting on this rubbish? Well, if you need proof that the modern Ethiopo-"Greeks" are killing and murdering Macedonians, just watch the NEWS these days! See what they are doing! STEALING OUR HISTORY! And they are supported by brainwashed people like YOU!
Shame on you all... I hold you all accountable for the situation in which my country is now. Our land has been stolen. Our people have been killed. We are not even allowed our own name.
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And, even if we bought into your rather obscure brand of misinformed ethnic insanity (Macenazism?), WTF would it have to do with the fact that an ancient people built a remarkable computing device?
To date, you haven't presented so much as a shred of evidence for your bizarre and irrelevant claim that Greeks are Ethiopians. I think you have a huge problem with most of the world, rather than an imagined gathering of "Hellenists" here. Macedonians are welcome to their history.
BTW, Alexander the Great of Macedon bragged that he had Greek ancestry. How you like them apples, Mr. Pure Macedonian?
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 09:45:13 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by freewest4ever
You guys are still posting on this rubbish? |
As are you. That's pretty funny. I guess it's tough to make a snide remark about people commenting on something without commenting on it yourself, thus demonstrating the hypocrisy of your remark. The only way to truly show your derision for the topic at hand is to keep your trap shut, but that's easily mistaken for simply not caring. But you care a great deal, so much so that you find yourself driven to insult people who care enough to comment. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 11:17:55 [Permalink]
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More misinformation,
The Macedonians were considered barbarians by the Mycenean greeks. Until Phillip II, the Macedonians did nothing particularly remarkable, in the time leading up to Alexander they were only a city-state melting pot of Dorians/Illyrians?sp/and myceneans. They sold Greece out to the Persians who still lost to the Spartans led land forces and Athenian navy, both of whom were vastly superior to Macedon in ability and tactics. Then one of the Macedon's lesser Alexanders instigated the Pelleponnisian Wars between Athens and Sparta, weakening they're powers enough for his successors to conquer the area.
Its been awhile since I read my history but Im certain that Im a hell of a lot closer to reality than you are. I dont think anything in this thread whether it has been whitewashed by history or not justifies your lunatic 2500 year old conspiracy/grudge nor have you given Macedon anything but a bad name. A worse ambassador I have never met. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2008 : 12:31:52 [Permalink]
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freewest4ever, may I make a suggestion? I will anyway, of course: As this thread involves a conversation on a rather remarkable and ancient machine, and nobody much gives a dingo's kidney about the ethnicity nor the politics of it's creators, why don't you start one that does?
It's a fascinating bit of history and one that I myself, whould like to know more about. So instead of getting all bent out of off-topic shape over the mechanism, lay some history on us why don't you.
If I remember right, Philip II was murdered by Pausanias of Orestis, who might or might not have been one of his male lovers, depending upon who you're reading. And that's as far as I'll discuss it in this thread.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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knkavo
New Member
Greece
11 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 07:49:21 [Permalink]
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If you google freewest4ever, you'll see that he is little more than a troll. A troll who does some good research and studies just how to drive people totally nuts, but just a troll. I've seen him support gay rights, then bash gays, support black nationalism, white supremacists, Greek irredentists, Turkish imperialists, and now Macedonians.
It reminds me of an incident a few years ago when Greece and Turkey came close to conflict over a video on youtube, showing Kemal Attaturk professing his homosexuality. Flame wars ensued, the news networks of both countries were devoted to nothing else, and it turned out to have been posted by an Englishman who was annoyed by his crappy holidays in Greece the summer before. No Greeks or Turks were involved at all! Makes me wonder how much hate is started in this way.
Anyway, this is a great site and an interesting thread. It's sad that here in Greece the only people who show any interest in the Mechanism are the kind of lunatic fringe far-right Greeks who freewest4ever sometimes pretends to be.
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'Oh, obvious,' said Granny. 'I'll grant you it is obvious. Trouble is, just because things are obvious doesn't mean they're true.' - Granny Weatherwax
"You have insulted my footwear. My sandals do not like to be laughed at." - Samurai Jack |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 07:56:04 [Permalink]
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| Welcome knkavo, it's good to hear from eastern Europe, we dont have many posters from the region. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 08:06:47 [Permalink]
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Hi knkavo & welcome!
Troll huh? Now I really hope he comes back. We like trolls and here, there be dragons! 
I haven't read anything on the Antikythera Mechanism in quite some time. Anybody gotta update?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 10:04:34 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by freewest4ever
Nobody crosses MY bridge! |
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"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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knkavo
New Member
Greece
11 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 13:42:44 [Permalink]
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http://www.antikythera-mechanism.gr/el/data/models/solid-models.html
These are some photos of some models that have been made of the Mechanism, sorry that it's all in Greek.
I actually can't find anything in Greek more recent than 2005-2006, where they state that the mechanism was about to be put through an MRI scan...? |
'Oh, obvious,' said Granny. 'I'll grant you it is obvious. Trouble is, just because things are obvious doesn't mean they're true.' - Granny Weatherwax
"You have insulted my footwear. My sandals do not like to be laughed at." - Samurai Jack |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 13:51:50 [Permalink]
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Welcome to SFN, knkavo! Thanks very much for that background on the troll, freewest2ever. I'd rather be able to think of him as a single trollish individual, than as representing some vile and twisted, extremist nationalist movement.
I hope you'll stick around!
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2008 : 16:15:54 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by knkavo
http://www.antikythera-mechanism.gr/el/data/models/solid-models.html
These are some photos of some models that have been made of the Mechanism, sorry that it's all in Greek.
I actually can't find anything in Greek more recent than 2005-2006, where they state that the mechanism was about to be put through an MRI scan...?
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And now I wish I could speak/read Greek. Years back (mid '50s), in Tarpon Springs, FL, I had a Greek girlfriend who's cradle language was her family's native tongue. I should have paid more attention to their discussions.
Great models & photos -- Thanks!
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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