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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
 Posted - 05/17/2007 : 07:42:28 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Cuneiformist---
The data pattern is unreliable but here is the reason we see the pattern.
I can not understand your logic.
Why would a presentation of reason for an action be presented for an action that is not occurring?
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It's not my logic; it's what I cut-and-pasted in the article. Re-read it. Better, go to your local library and find the whole article and follow it along. You're saying that B doesn't match A. They're saying that B and A are almost certainly closer to matching than the chart suggests, and even if B doesn't match A exactly, it's OK since natural processes make this the expected result.
Again, re-read the article. If you don't understand it, or can't comprehend it, then just admit that you object to something you don't even understand. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 07:48:34 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave---What would other man made causes for temp increases be?
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Deforestation is a good one. You failed to open the Wikipedia link I put up, didn't you?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 08:06:08 [Permalink]
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Filthy---www.newscientist.com/article/dn10521-forest-growth-is-encouraging-say-researchers.html
"Contrary to common belief, forests in many nations are expanding not shrinking, say researchers."
That problem looks like its being solved. |
What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 08:14:26 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave---What would other man made causes for temp increases be? |
I was talking about the natural cycle, not the man-made increase. That's why the usual CO2 lag is absent this time around, because man's activities have invented the cycle. You claimed the inversion is disproof of the MMGW "logic," but you've got the logic all wrong. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 08:17:48 [Permalink]
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Nice quote mine. Check the next sentence:...while the majority of the world's most forested countries are still losing trees... "Many" doesn't mean "most." In this case, it doesn't even mean "half." |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 08:19:29 [Permalink]
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Dave---What would have caused the temp to decrease in the past when co2 was at peaks?
If co2 causes warming, something must have stopped the warming process in the past dispite co2 being at peaks.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 08:23:41 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave---What would have caused the temp to decrease in the past when co2 was at peaks?
If co2 causes warming, something must have stopped the warming process in the past dispite co2 being at peaks. |
You apparently need a complete education in climate change theory (meaning you've just been talking out your butt so far), and I don't currently have the time to provide it. Maybe later. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 05/17/2007 : 09:14:23 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Nice quote mine. Check the next sentence:...while the majority of the world's most forested countries are still losing trees... "Many" doesn't mean "most." In this case, it doesn't even mean "half."
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Quote mining now? 
JEROME, JEROME, JEROME, what's to be done with you?
Ok, I will again attempt to render assistance, but you've got to help. You've got to open the following links and seriously study them.
Logical fallacies #1.
Logical fallacies #2.
Logical Fallacies #3.
Work with me here, JEROME. It can save you a lot of hassle on down the road.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 13:14:12 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Nice quote mine. Check the next sentence:...while the majority of the world's most forested countries are still losing trees... "Many" doesn't mean "most." In this case, it doesn't even mean "half."
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JEROME DA GNOME, I didn't think you'd be this dishonest!
By taking a quote out of context, and make it look like it
s saying the opposite of the author intended, is misrepresenting the author.
That's lying.
If you lie to us like this, how can we trust you to be truthful?
JEROME DA GNOME, you just lost a lot of credibility here.
(edited to fix grammar) |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 05/17/2007 13:15:11 |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 18:37:00 [Permalink]
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To all: Your accusations of quote mining are unfounded.
I claimed the situation was improving.
I could have used a more clear statement, but I did not claim it was solved only its being solved.
The statement I quoted is in concert with the article.
In fact, Daves quote is "quote mining" as he did not even use an entire sentence and the quote is out of concert with the article.
"...while the majority of the world's most forested countries are still losing trees..."
In context the end of his quote is in concert with the quote I used.
"They say that while the majority of the world's most forested countries are still losing trees, the number that are gaining forests is rising."
So dave took part of a sentence out of context; and I took an entire sentence which highlites the entire point of the article titled "Forest growth is encouraging, say researchers".
I am never intentionally dishonest.
I have not come here to deceive to prove my point.
If my points are not taken, it means little, this is an enjoyable exercise of the mind.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 19:15:23 [Permalink]
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From todays paper, I dont have a link but this should be able to be found easily if necessary.
"New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson who has called for dramatic reductions in the use of fossil fuels reported in his federal financial statement holdings between $250,000 and $500,000 in stock options, and owns between $100,000 and $250,000 in stock in Valero Energy Corp.- the nations largest independent oil refinery."
Dramatic reductions in fossil fuels would increase his wealth dramatically as restrictions in the use of a product that is desired will increase its value.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 19:29:30 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
In fact, Daves quote is "quote mining" as he did not even use an entire sentence and the quote is out of concert with the article. |
You are deluding yourself. The article had two points: one that deforestation is still a major concern, and two, that it's getting slightly better. You presented one side of that from the article, I presented the rest of the information.
I didn't present the quote in order to make a point about deforestation being a concern. I presented the quote solely because you presented an out-of-context quote which made it seem like we should be somehow less concerned about the continuing problem - even if the problem is getting better.| I am never intentionally dishonest. |
Then what should you do when someone tells you that what you state is the "logic of mmgw" is wrong? Obviously, you should acknowledge the limits of what you "know" and attempt to rectify the situation. Have you done so regarding the CO2 and temperature cycles? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 19:31:34 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
From todays paper, I dont have a link but this should be able to be found easily if necessary.
"New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson who has called for dramatic reductions in the use of fossil fuels reported in his federal financial statement holdings between $250,000 and $500,000 in stock options, and owns between $100,000 and $250,000 in stock in Valero Energy Corp.- the nations largest independent oil refinery."
Dramatic reductions in fossil fuels would increase his wealth dramatically as restrictions in the use of a product that is desired will increase its value. |
Good point. Richardson tells people that we shouldn't use fossil fuels like oil, and yet cleverly has invested money in an oil refinery. I smell conspiracy. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 19:40:03 [Permalink]
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Dave---"Then what should you do when someone tells you that what you state is the "logic of mmgw" is wrong?"
--I respectfully disagree, and show data which supports my view.
"Have you done so regarding the CO2 and temperature cycles?"
--Historical data shows temp increases cause co2 increases; in fact others have posted science that supports this fact.
Are you stating that temp increases do not increase co2 levels?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2007 : 19:44:15 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
From todays paper, I dont have a link but this should be able to be found easily if necessary.
"New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson who has called for dramatic reductions in the use of fossil fuels reported in his federal financial statement holdings between $250,000 and $500,000 in stock options, and owns between $100,000 and $250,000 in stock in Valero Energy Corp.- the nations largest independent oil refinery."
Dramatic reductions in fossil fuels would increase his wealth dramatically as restrictions in the use of a product that is desired will increase its value.
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You know, if he owned stock in companies that are on the leading edge in the production of alternative energy you would make the same argument.
And with the decrees in fossil fuels and a corresponding increase in alternatives, which will certainly follow, where is the demand?
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Is Global Warming a Scam (part 2)
Topic Locked
