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Marc_a_b
Skeptic Friend
USA
142 Posts |
 Posted - 09/12/2001 : 06:47:37
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The disgusting Sylvia Brown *gag* seems to be the first psychic to claim to have predicted the tragedy. Will others stoop so low as to try and either capitolized or promote themselves with the?  A copy of her stupid self promotion and commentary can be found here:
http://www.geocities.com/labrys_bh/false/falseeditorial_attack.html
When we hit the terrorists back, can we strap  Sylvia to the bombs? 
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Greg
Skeptic Friend
USA
281 Posts |
 Posted - 09/12/2001 : 06:59:38 [Permalink]
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She is in the same league as the gasoline price gougers!!!
Greg.
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The Rat
SFN Regular
Canada
1370 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 07:03:52 [Permalink]
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quote:
The disgusting Sylvia Brown 
I read your link. Now I think I need a shower.
I hope Jim Randi cuts her a new arsehole.
Free speech; excercise it or SHUT UP! |
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Piltdown
Skeptic Friend
USA
312 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 07:28:42 [Permalink]
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quote:
The disgusting Sylvia Brown *gag* seems to be the first psychic to claim to have predicted the tragedy. Will others stoop so low as to try and either capitolized or promote themselves with the? A copy of her stupid self promotion and commentary can be found here:
http://www.geocities.com/labrys_bh/false/falseeditorial_attack.html
When we hit the terrorists back, can we strap  Sylvia to the bombs? 
I would go farther. Psychism as a major component of popular culture dates from the 1960s, as do the rhetoric and worldview which allow terrorism to flourish: the assumption that some kind of moral equivalency exists between terrorists and victims, that the democracys' own efforts to mitigate terrorist assaults somehow feed and encourage those assaults, and that there is a "cycle of violence" that would stop if we would only appease terrorist supporters, and endorse their version of justice. This is deep and profound hypocrisy, institutionalized in our society, and sanctified by popular culture and the academic establishment. The assumption of one standard for terrorist supporters and a different one for their targets has become institutionalized in our culture, with 30+ years of hypocritical rhetoric to justify it. The constant yammering about a "cycle of violence" is especially odious, since it essentially endorses the terrorists' stated rationale. This is reality, people, there is no "cycle of violence". The terrorists cannot be stopped by any change in our policy short of our joining them in their war of annihilation against Jews and other "infidels." The hypocrisy of the 60s class war has come home to roost.
Abducting UFOs and conspiring against conspiracy theorists since 1980. |
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Greg
Skeptic Friend
USA
281 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 07:54:14 [Permalink]
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quote:
I would go farther. Psychism as a major component of popular culture dates from the 1960s, as do the rhetoric and worldview which allow terrorism to flourish: the assumption that some kind of moral equivalency exists between terrorists and victims, that the democracys' own efforts to mitigate terrorist assaults somehow feed and encourage those assaults, and that there is a "cycle of violence" that would stop if we would only appease terrorist supporters, and endorse their version of justice. This is deep and profound hypocrisy, institutionalized in our society, and sanctified by popular culture and the academic establishment. The assumption of one standard for terrorist supporters and a different one for their targets has become institutionalized in our culture, with 30+ years of hypocritical rhetoric to justify it. The constant yammering about a "cycle of violence" is especially odious, since it essentially endorses the terrorists' stated rationale. This is reality, people, there is no "cycle of violence". The terrorists cannot be stopped by any change in our policy short of our joining them in their war of annihilation against Jews and other "infidels." The hypocrisy of the 60s class war has come home to roost.
Bullshit. Israel has, from day one dealt swiftly and harshly with terrorists and the countries that support them. Tell me there is no cycle of violence there. No one either on this board, or acedemics I have heard have suggested appeasement. We only want peace and justice for everyone rather than terror and violence. We will find those who did this (hopefully) whether international or domestic (or both) and punish them. We then need to rethink how we treat others around the world. To pin this act on liberal idealism is a revolting insult to those who work for peace. Are you sure your name isn't Rush?
Greg.
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Piltdown
Skeptic Friend
USA
312 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 09:19:30 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
I would go farther. Psychism as a major component of popular culture dates from the 1960s, as do the rhetoric and worldview which allow terrorism to flourish: the assumption that some kind of moral equivalency exists between terrorists and victims, that the democracys' own efforts to mitigate terrorist assaults somehow feed and encourage those assaults, and that there is a "cycle of violence" that would stop if we would only appease terrorist supporters, and endorse their version of justice. This is deep and profound hypocrisy, institutionalized in our society, and sanctified by popular culture and the academic establishment. The assumption of one standard for terrorist supporters and a different one for their targets has become institutionalized in our culture, with 30+ years of hypocritical rhetoric to justify it. The constant yammering about a "cycle of violence" is especially odious, since it essentially endorses the terrorists' stated rationale. This is reality, people, there is no "cycle of violence". The terrorists cannot be stopped by any change in our policy short of our joining them in their war of annihilation against Jews and other "infidels." The hypocrisy of the 60s class war has come home to roost.
Bullshit. Israel has, from day one dealt swiftly and harshly with terrorists and the countries that support them. Tell me there is no cycle of violence there. No one either on this board, or acedemics I have heard have suggested appeasement. We only want peace and justice for everyone rather than terror and violence. We will find those who did this (hopefully) whether international or domestic (or both) and punish them. We then need to rethink how we treat others around the world. To pin this act on liberal idealism is a revolting insult to those who work for peace. Are you sure your name isn't Rush?
Greg.
The "cycle of violence" began 53 years ago when the Arab world attacked the newly founded State of Israel with the sworn goal of driving the Jews into the sea. Many have relented from that goal, and the "cycle of violence" has somehow ended for them, even though Israel continues to deal harshly with terrorists. When was the last time Israeli planes bombed Egypt?
I am not interested in a terrorist's version of justice. Osama bin Ladin might have some kind of legitimate complaint. So what? There are legitimate complaints about FBI conduct at Waco, but every rational person can at least recognize that Tim McVeigh was not the final arbiter and advocate of justice.
Hypocrisy masquerading as idealism empowers terrorists. The terrorists certainly will not break this alleged "cycle of violence" which clearly means that only the victims can---by not responding or by changing their policies to suit terrorist objectives. That is appeasement. It scarcely matters that its advocates do not call it that.
Terrorist outrages are not based on a victims' violent response to earlier outrages. They are based on the cold-blooded manipulation of potential victims, terrorism is propaganda and rhetoric extended to an ultimate level of ruthlessness, a kind of psychological warfare. Terrorism happens because it works for the perpetrators. We can stop it by taking away the incentive.
I do not believe that a military assault on terrorist supporters would provoke further terrorist outrages, though it could obviously serve as a claimed rationale. The terrorists' incentive to commit acts of terror will exist in any case, as long as there is any possibility that these acts will further the terrorists' propaganda goals, and as long as terrorist gangs anywhere in the world are opposed to any aspect of our policy.
Nevertheless, military action should be subject to the most careful planning and consideration. An ill-considered attack to appease public opinion would be useless and self-defeating, since it would only magnify the impression of weakness. I hope that Dubya's advisors can convince him to take a rational and cautious approach.
BTW, I have no idea what Rush Limbaugh might be saying about this, but the possibility exists that it is similar to what I have said. That would be unusual, but not unheard of; nor would it necessarily refute anything I have said, any more than claims of "bullshit" or offended feelings would.
Abducting UFOs and conspiring against conspiracy theorists since 1980. |
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Greg
Skeptic Friend
USA
281 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 10:18:30 [Permalink]
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Terrorism exists because people have a reason for it. It's easy to say that the perpetrators of this action are "crazy" but the evidence suggests otherwise. If multiple individuals are willing to commit suicide for their "cause", and there have been many in previous years, then we had better damn well pay attention to what that cause is. I believe that Israel is an easy fous point for these groups because no one in the Arab world sees that nation as legitimate. The only reason that nations such as Egypt and Saudi Arabia are not fighting Isreal right now is that it is in the financial interests of these nations to make nice with the US. Egypt had their president assasinated because of his overture to Israel that led to Camp David I. This is not violence? If Bin Laden is involved, it is of note also that he is a Saudi. You are saying that people in these countries don't want violence? It's just the rulers making the rules that don't want war because of financial interest.
I am not making excuses or blaming victims. You sir, are punching a straw man argument. I want to see this shit end as much as you do, but I also think that we Americans should stand up worldwide to the principles that this country was founded upon and not act like the imperialist bully that we got rid of.
Greg.
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 10:19:04 [Permalink]
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I thought the cycle of violence started with the ethnic cleansing that created Israel in the first place. Jews fighting to create Israel burned Arab homes and forced them off their lands. If I was an Arab, I would have been pissed, too. Now there's an alien state that doesn't fit in at all with its neighbors and the neighbors all hate it. Israel has bullied every nation in the region for years and they have only been able to do so with the backing of the US.
@tomic
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law! |
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I Doubt It
New Member
USA
12 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 11:13:05 [Permalink]
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I've had at least 2 people tell me on another postboard that they are getting messages from their friends that Nostradamus predicted this. Of course, this infuriates me. And I tell them so - what the hell good is this "prediction" when you can't understand the thing and take any action on the foreknowledge. I'm annoyed this will increase that blatherer's popularity.
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Greg
Skeptic Friend
USA
281 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 11:14:39 [Permalink]
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http://www.msnbc.com/news/190144.asp
We need to eliminate the governments that harbor these people and opress their own. We need to start now. We can't play the old pay them off game anymore.
Greg.
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The Rat
SFN Regular
Canada
1370 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 11:22:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
what the hell good is this "prediction" when you can't understand the thing and take any action on the foreknowledge.
I found this thread this morning just as I was about to start one very similar. I was going to call it "Where were the psychics?", and follow up with a prediction that they would soon be claiming to have known about it all along.
Looks like we non-psychics are better at seeing the future than the geniune article. Syndicated newspaper column, here I come!
Free speech; excercise it or SHUT UP! |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
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Rift
Skeptic Friend
USA
333 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 17:57:44 [Permalink]
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You beat me to that link, tokyo :) At least the fakers could do minimal research and get the date of his death right... lol
As for *living* psychics, isn't withholding information to a crime that is about to be perpitrated ilegal? If Sylvia felt this was going to happened so strongly, why didn't she warn anybody???
Sollag is another scumbag that claims to have forseen all this. He's a newsgroup kook. If you want to see his insane ramblings just check the newgroup sci.skeptic. Hard to believe, but he makes Slyvia look like Little Mary Sunshine.
"Goddammit! The world is just filling up with more and more idiots! And the computer is giving them access to the world! They're
spreading their stupidity! At least they were contained before--now they're on the loose everywhere!"? |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 19:33:13 [Permalink]
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You probably mean Sollog, right?
http://skepdic.com/sollog.html
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Hope springs eternal but there's no conviction
Actions mistaken for lip service paid
All this concern is the true contradiction
The world is insane... |
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Rift
Skeptic Friend
USA
333 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 23:20:49 [Permalink]
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Sollag, Sollog, he's an idiot anyway you spell is name :)
BTW, Snopes already has a page up about the fake Nostradamus Quatraine (and Nostradamus in general), and, as always, it's very well written and very good.
http://www.snopes2.com/inboxer/hoaxes/predict.htm
"Goddammit! The world is just filling up with more and more idiots! And the computer is giving them access to the world! They're
spreading their stupidity! At least they were contained before--now they're on the loose everywhere!"? |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2001 : 23:45:22 [Permalink]
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quote:
Sollag, Sollog, he's an idiot anyway you spell is name :)
Definitely! 
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Hope springs eternal but there's no conviction
Actions mistaken for lip service paid
All this concern is the true contradiction
The world is insane... |
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