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Siberia
SFN Addict

Brazil
2322 Posts

Posted - 11/26/2005 :  03:04:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Siberia's Homepage  Send Siberia an AOL message  Send Siberia a Yahoo! Message Send Siberia a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

quote:

Why donn't you try?


To what end? I am neither scientist nor philosopher, and my interests are concentrated elsewhere. It is anough that I am conscious (mostly), and that I can use that consciousness in pursuit of that which does interests me.




Exactly! Though I'd say I simply don't care.

"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa

"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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Subjectmatter
Skeptic Friend

173 Posts

Posted - 11/26/2005 :  11:40:22   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Subjectmatter a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Storm

How do we define material from immaterial? ... What is wrong with religion?



The material is that which we percieve and conceptualise into objects, is forms a closed system based on the principles of cause and effect.

The immaterial is simply the privation of the material; that is, that which exists formally but not materially. Such things include the principles of the natural world (physical laws such as the law of the conservation of matter and energy) ethical laws (the Moral Law) logical laws (the law on non-contradiction, the identity law, the law of the excluded middle), forms (such as mathematics) abstract objects such as emotions, thoughts and words and of course, the active subject.


What is wrong with religion is that it advocates 'faith' as a means of aquiring truth, to the exclusion of reason. necessarily to the exclusion of reason. 'Faith' at best can be characterised as emotional reasoning; an informal logical fallacy, and at worst it can be characterised as a form of psychosis.

Sibling Atom Bomb of Couteous Debate
Edited by - Subjectmatter on 11/26/2005 11:42:02
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9666 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2005 :  00:14:46   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message
Wow, Subjectmatter. Short and concise. I'm not sure I agree to all aspects of the post, but the general thrust of it was good.

Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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filthy
SFN Die Hard

USA
14408 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2005 :  00:20:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send filthy a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse

Wow, Subjectmatter. Short and concise. I'm not sure I agree to all aspects of the post, but the general thrust of it was good.

Looks like a PoM candidate to me...


"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)

"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres


"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude

Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,

and Crypto-Communist!

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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9666 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2005 :  14:43:03   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by filthy

quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse

Wow, Subjectmatter. Short and concise. I'm not sure I agree to all aspects of the post, but the general thrust of it was good.

Looks like a PoM candidate to me...



What do you wait for? Nominate it!

Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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Chippewa
SFN Regular

USA
1496 Posts

Posted - 11/27/2005 :  16:24:23   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Chippewa's Homepage Send Chippewa a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse

Wow, Subjectmatter. Short and concise. I'm not sure I agree to all aspects of the post, but the general thrust of it was good.


Bam! I think I just heard a hammer hit a nail on the head.

Diversity, independence, innovation and imagination are progressive concepts ultimately alien to the conservative mind.

"TAX AND SPEND" IS GOOD! (TAX: Wealthy corporations who won't go poor even after taxes. SPEND: On public works programs, education, the environment, improvements.)
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard

USA
3834 Posts

Posted - 11/28/2005 :  02:39:49   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send beskeptigal a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Storm

... What is wrong with religion?...


It's holding society back. Think how stupid it is that the human race still mostly thinks there is some magical being(s) out there. They think nothing of dismissing myths until it comes to their own mythical beliefs then they are blind to the fact there is no essential difference.

Even basic claims like religion provides morality can be shown to have no basis whatsoever, yet that myth persists.

Claims that the Bible says this or that isn't valid. If you read the thing, it doesn't back up what each religion claims it says. An eye for an eye, turn the other cheek, don't kill, do kill, and so on. The contradictions alone should convince people it's nonsense, but it doesn't.

Instead, religion encourages society to limit science because it challenges the basis for the mythical beliefs. Well, duh! Their mythical beliefs.

Not to mention the war thing since war is over power and resources, one can't be sure without religion wars would cease, but religion certainly gives leaders tools to control soldiers with.

I just want the human race to move on intellectually.
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astropin
SFN Regular

USA
970 Posts

Posted - 11/28/2005 :  11:43:16   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send astropin a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Kil

quote:
Storm:
…What does light have in common with Consciousness...


Well, it has often been said; “The lights are on but no one's home.”




Sorry for the delay but, ROTFLMAO!

I would rather face a cold reality than delude myself with comforting fantasies.

You are free to believe what you want to believe and I am free to ridicule you for it.

Atheism:
The result of an unbiased and rational search for the truth.

Infinitus est numerus stultorum
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