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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 08:35:21 [Permalink]
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It's funny when the Constitution is brought up with regard to private Internet sites. As though there is a way that we could even prevent their right to free speech. We aren't required to provide a forum for anyone. But that doesn't limit their speech. It's like saying that if Fred Phelps wants to spew his garbage here, we have to let him because he has free speech rights guaranteed by the Constitution. What's funny about that is conservatives are very protective about the rights of private ownership. Does the Constitution protect my right to post on Uncommon Descent? Not at all. It's their site. But here, we have been called really horrible names by jamalrapper and haven't banned him an he's complaining. I asked a polite question at UD and was summarily banned for asking it. That's there right. They own the site.
It's in the public square that speech is protected. The irony is that we are very liberal in our application of speech, and yet we are being accused of silencing people simply because we didn't agree with them. We have rarely agreed with Bill Scott and several others, and they are still members in good standing. Why? Because they didn't become abusive. They have followed the registration agreement that you agreed to jamalrapper. An agreement that you had to understand and acknowledge in order to post here. It's a standard agreement that all forums have, and you haven't kept the agreement with us and yet you are still here. So once again, you have made a baseless charge against us. Par for you, and also boring. I again submit that there isn't a forum in the Internet that would tolerate being called some of the names you have called us, and your been allowed to come back the next day to do it again. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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jamalrapper
Sockpuppet
213 Posts |
 Posted - 02/24/2012 : 10:55:28 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
It's funny when the Constitution is brought up with regard to private Internet sites. As though there is a way that we could even prevent their right to free speech. We aren't required to provide a forum for anyone. But that doesn't limit their speech. It's like saying that if Fred Phelps wants to spew his garbage here, we have to let him because he has free speech rights guaranteed by the Constitution. What's funny about that is conservatives are very protective about the rights of private ownership. Does the Constitution protect my right to post on Uncommon Descent? Not at all. It's their site. But here, we have been called really horrible names by jamalrapper and haven't banned him an he's complaining. I asked a polite question at UD and was summarily banned for asking it. That's there right. They own the site.
It's in the public square that speech is protected. The irony is that we are very liberal in our application of speech, and yet we are being accused of silencing people simply because we didn't agree with them. We have rarely agreed with Bill Scott and several others, and they are still members in good standing. Why? Because they didn't become abusive. They have followed the registration agreement that you agreed to jamalrapper. An agreement that you had to understand and acknowledge in order to post here. It's a standard agreement that all forums have, and you haven't kept the agreement with us and yet you are still here. So once again, you have made a baseless charge against us. Par for you, and also boring. I again submit that there isn't a forum in the Internet that would tolerate being called some of the names you have called us, and your been allowed to come back the next day to do it again.
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I sympathize with you Kil. But I don't believe by this site being more liberal than the other sites is driving people away. The most contentious post are often the most visited. Depth, profundity, controversial, intrigue....and of course facts raises the interest of members passionate in the human drama unfolding.
You just have to raise the quality of the responses so people will actually read and take what is applicable to them and remember what touched them the best, the most and the longest.
Like Michael Jordan said..."the more I lose the more I win." Maybe you guys are winners by such standards. You just don't know it. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13476 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 11:08:10 [Permalink]
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jamalrapper:
I sympathize with you Kil. But I don't believe by this site being more liberal than the other sites is driving people away. |
First off, you just changed the subject. Next, I have been told by some old members that they were leaving because we were allowing too much incivility by visitors, and to some extent by our long standing members. But If you wish to call me a liar about that, what can I do? I'll tell you what. I don't really care. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 12:17:34 [Permalink]
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Emphasis below mine:
Originally posted by jamalrapper
I don't know how you put this logic together Kil. Yes I signed up because of the research I am undertaking. |
Call me skeptical, but I don't believe you.
| I picked a topic with creation/evolution because I have researched a lot of material on those subjects. |
Call me skeptical, but I don't believe you.
It turned out to be a good choice because most threads here I noticed don't really generate much interest. I needed one that would in a very short time expose me to as many members and opinions/expertise. |
Call me skeptical, but I don't believe you. You intentionally posted off topic posts in a fresh thread for the obvious reason to disrupt the conversation.
I also picked the yeast multicellular thread because here again it is along the same lines of evolutionary transitions.
These were not random choices but purpose driven. It was chosen to see how skeptics on this site handle topics which they are obviously not qualified for. |
This is your ignorance showing on so many levels. For one, you don't seem to get that random chance is only one of many factors working together. Natural and artificial selection is what makes evolution purpose-driven.
I am doing a research on skeptics and I can choose any methodology I want which will produce the results and conclusion in the most effective and economical way. |
LMFAO. Call me skeptical, but I don't believe you. The moment you "exposed" you purpose here as research, you blew your "research".
As for Dr Mabuse. I don't know if he is aware SOPA the Internet Censorship bill was defeated or put on hold. Since when did US Laws infringe on Swedish Laws. You should announce such developments.
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I can't believe you would post something this stupid. But it has already been addressed by now. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 13:08:37 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
As far as the links are concerned. They are all in the public domain. |
What links? You only left the link which identified the list of skeptics in this post. Since that list was properly referenced with a link to Wikipedia, (which by the way isn't public domain, but is published under a licence similar to GNU-public licence), and Wikipedia allows re-publishing of articles as long as the source is given, we could keep that list without violating copyright laws.
| Dr Mabuse deleted a bibliographical listings from Wiki and AIG. |
Referring to this post.
How is I or anyone else to know those listings came from Wikipedia? You didn't say so in your post, nor did you post any link to the source. Since the source of none of the three lists were readily apparent in your post, the entire set of lists could have been copied from a website holding a copyright.
As it turned out, I recognised that the last list of names actually did belong to AiG. So you suddenly and without notice switched source, which is dishonest because the lists from different sources may not be comparable. And without knowing where the lists came from, we cannot evaluate their relevance and relative worth. And AiG has copyright on that list, and they do explicitly state in their copyright notice that none of their material is to be considered public domain. Even material which is explicitly offered "free for use" are not public domain but requires an AiG copyright notice.
The AIG you had already found and edited the listing source. |
Yes, that's how I recognised that part of the listings. And you knew that you were violating a copyright when you posted it, since you knew I had edited an exactly identical list from one of your posts before, for that very purpose. You are obviously intentionally violating the Skeptic Friends Network user agreement. Which is a banable offence. And now you're bitching about it? Tread carefully here.
I can see where it might serve some purpose to deleted a comparison made between list of skeptic proponents/writers and comparable list of true biologist/scientist theist and creationist. Using the same skeptic logic. |
It was your actions which forced me to make those deletions in order to protect SFN. Nothing stops you from re-posting those lists again, provided that you clearly attribute them to the source, like posting a link and say: "these two lists comes from Wikipedia" or post a link and putting the lists inside quote-tags. It's so simple, and not at all time-consuming: you have yourself to blame. You have been told several times to post proper attributions.
| How can I be wrong when I agree with so many biologist/scientist. |
They are wrong, and they are not many.
| Surely they can't all be wrong. |
Yes they can, because they are not representative of the consensus opinion on evolution.
| Or the converse of skeptical logic. |
You couldn't tell logic from equine turd.
| Just because the majority believe in one way does not necessarily make it true. |
That depends entirely on how you define "majority" and "true". In a general sense, the logical fallacy argumentum ad populum is really a fallacy.
But there is a situation where argumentum ad populum isn't a logical fallacy:
Scientific consensus.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 13:21:40 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
You guys are a bunch of cowards hiding behind your firewall shutting out critical expression. This site has banned so many members. It should be deemed a failed site.
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Unsupported allegation.
SFN has a very high tolerance (your still being here is evidence of that). I've seen other forums, like JREF, banning people for much less than the shit you've pulled off here. And I won't even mention religious sites... they are even more touchier. I got banned from a christian forum for saying I had a nightmare in which George W. Bush was the anti-christ.  |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 13:34:37 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
You just have to raise the quality of the responses so people will actually read and take what is applicable to them and remember what touched them the best, the most and the longest. |
You're right. Perhaps we should take you up on your suggestion and go through your posts and delete those which contain abusive language. That would definitly raise the quality of responses.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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jamalrapper
Sockpuppet
213 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 14:10:51 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
jamalrapper:
I sympathize with you Kil. But I don't believe by this site being more liberal than the other sites is driving people away. |
First off, you just changed the subject. Next, I have been told by some old members that they were leaving because we were allowing too much incivility by visitors, and to some extent by our long standing members. But If you wish to call me a liar about that, what can I do? I'll tell you what. I don't really care.
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I hear you Kil. But I've participated on forums that average 20,000 reads and over 20 participants. The ones who complain the most are the same members who hardly post.
Maybe that explains why you got bumped so quickly on some of the other forums. It just takes a few "click to report" and the moderators give up and get rid of the targeted member to keep the peace.
You guys are a determined bunch. I wish I could do more here but I don't want to overstay my welcome. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 14:26:20 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
...I don't want to overstay my welcome. |
Did you receive a welcome in the first place? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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jamalrapper
Sockpuppet
213 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 15:12:30 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by jamalrapper
...I don't want to overstay my welcome. |
Did you receive a welcome in the first place?
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I am willing to look the other way and give you guys credit for being nice. But there should be more proof than that to convince our skeptics here.
You are a forum admin/moderator and you know the rules of the game. Ignore the person and he/she will go away. But that ain't so here.
I am being helped with my spelling mistakes, public etiquette, immediate response to my posts.
In fact I feel spoilt here with the attention I am being showered with.
If it wasn't for the research I couldn't justify the time I am spending here. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 16:52:13 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
You are a forum admin/moderator and you know the rules of the game. Ignore the person and he/she will go away. |
I've never seen that advice work. Ignoring trolls doesn't make them go away, it makes them ramp up their trolling. So does interacting with them, but at least that way we get to try to figure out what makes each particular one tick, and possibly hasten the inevitable kiss-off. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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jamalrapper
Sockpuppet
213 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 16:58:24 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by jamalrapper
You are a forum admin/moderator and you know the rules of the game. Ignore the person and he/she will go away. |
I've never seen that advice work. Ignoring trolls doesn't make them go away, it makes them ramp up their trolling. So does interacting with them, but at least that way we get to try to figure out what makes each particular one tick, and possibly hasten the inevitable kiss-off.
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You all sound very upset. Which is very strange. Considering how many times you thought you were right. One might think you were enjoying being part of my research.
But seriously...What programming language do you code in? |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26021 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2012 : 19:51:12 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by jamalrapper
You all sound very upset. Which is very strange. |
Yeah, since I'm not upset.| But seriously...What programming language do you code in? |
But seriously... you think algae can be used to brew beer? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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jamalrapper
Sockpuppet
213 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2012 : 04:00:02 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by jamalrapper
You all sound very upset. Which is very strange. |
Yeah, since I'm not upset.| But seriously...What programming language do you code in? |
But seriously... you think algae can be used to brew beer?
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California is wine country DaveW and Sushi is big in LA. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9687 Posts |
Posted - 02/25/2012 : 06:18:00 [Permalink]
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You're up early on a Saturday morning...
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Yeast evolves multicellularity in lab in 60 days
