|
|
|
konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 09:39:09 [Permalink]
|
[Dave W 10/24/2007: 11:46:17, PG1]: I am not negating Darwin, if consciousness / will is frequentional. Understand: if there is work speed, which determines interaction density between me and kontext, and this work speed can be consciouss leveled, subconscious leveled, it allows me to suppose, that there is many consciouss-like levels within my existence, my ego, and only one selection of them, one conglomerate of levels and densities is myselfs conscioussness. Also we must suppose, that there is full relation between any human doings and human dna. We can easy imagine, that having different DNA would cause Breton not be surrealist, Bush be black skinned etc. So we can suppose there is language, constantly beeing spoken as we breath, speak, work, and evolve. And having supposed language also in surnames and names between generations, births and weaknesses, deaths, we can suppose we were planned to loose hirci by getting clothed. Also we planned to go with intelligency, not directly with nature but hand in hand hopefully. Also we must derive that there is no randomizeness at hypothetical language level of 500y interaction density. Yes, you cannot understand why there is bird instead of stegosaurus now, but can you also easy say there is no reason for that? That there is no collective reason, memory and deciding entity built in architecture, topology of nature and cities, which wides our mems of prescribed informations, which aren't created by us and now? I think there is no anti-evidence of upper consciousness, for which is human life only a red cell, transmitting oxygene. Taking it still from earth-biotic paradigm as I told before: we ARE only cells of it, and it is only evolving itself, using us, slavely. Or do you want to tell me, that any cell of your body is only dead messenger of your brain? I hope not. Also I am convinced, there were lot of conflicts between base cell entities, before multi-cell, brained organism was publicly approved. In other words I am convinced, that same as we are part of bigger consumal-dividing entity, our cells are working for us only in case, we are working for them, a bit. So there is some form of communism, holding our body together, not fighting inside. (communism because body is multi-centrally planned economy, as we must centralise production of and for brain, we must do that centralisation for muscles to support them...etc, if it was capitalism, it would more describe cancer performly). And you must agrée, that cars, fast food, television is case of cancer (understand me, there is really no matter to fill earth with people entirely, also it would bring earth to collapse). If anyone see relation between gass/drugs, demency/cancer, nature/body, I suppose, that this anyone is anyone of stability. Because in human cell society, there is no profit needed, no rise, no increase, no improvment, only static and secured stabil income. And this, I think should become target of human population: stability of income, lower nature conservancy in maximal value. Or are we playing game: drink every source as quick as possible, and see how long it is to prostrate living here. Also: can demand/offer system, which is globally and militarily widen, enable regulation of source levying? Or there is some get what you want and sell it for any matter, even if you are insane to kill yourself or anyone hidden in demand/offer.
Also: does human body allow atomic bomb inside it, or war? Isn't there necessity of top level regulations, weapon integration and control? Wouldn't it better for every human, to know, that we, scientists inbuilt some central sabotage unit to actual U235 weaponary all around the world, for hypothetical case* that USA is Germany at 45 in new colors? I mean: what chance to survive would rest of world have, if it was as said, with actual footing of weaponary? I hope it isn't so, but information structure, media, press in central europe, allow me to think this possibility. Isn't there necessity of anywhere present white militaries, which would try to securise areas against cancer - war? Or there is some fucking right to kill civilians in any ideal? And finally, again: is demand/offer system sufficient to survive? Or I will give weaponary to crazy if he will pay me? Shouldn't we decrease level of weaponary, in sense as genocide in 40's should stay last example of racism or militar system propagatory, AB use in Hiroshima, Nagasaki, should stay last use of AB to the end. Shouldn't we urge delevelising of weaponary all around? Or we can tell anyone of us is enough responsible to have these fucking dangerous thoughts and weapons? Isn't the time for demilitarisation and for doing what is to survive, not what is thought to be the best. Isn't that good, to slave 40 hours weekly 3/4 your live, knowing someone has weapons, which noone has right to use?
*) means: if we suppose that bush is hitler, and if we tried to create some enough fast survive plan and standart for this case, we surely have created something usefull and we surely increased over-world security. My plan is to create international anticonflict police, which has its own inspectors, its own courts, and where any misuse of force against any individual society, even if it has internal wars, is called crime, any attack is necessarily frozen, and any reasons are inspected. By-product should be clearing of informations between whole world about who is dangerous, and who is victim, because to now, informations and propagandas differ from country to country, what points out there is many dangerous misinterpretations, and payed desinformations all around. Question: Is there some country which wouldn't support international police system equipped with military forces, If there will be endeavor to integrate any social system - capitalised, comunised or of different type? Does anyone need help of organisation like this right now? Isn't there some sue request right now, at level of beeing endangered? Isn't there someone, who will sit in court for him? Who can tell there is no reason to infer militarism, weaponary height and desinformation. How can we allow standalone systems to be judged in public, and attacked without official command, through their constitution, religion. How we can tell them, we bring them goodness, if we bring them only street crime, intellect and faith decrease, public agression ignoration, and dangerous fast food cancerisation. Finally who will cover us, if we will not freeze actual agressions, judge them, for reasons of indifference and own focus at money. If there is no police to take control of situation in Iran and Usa, how can we say there is police in Iran and justice in Usa? Where is anti-militar court? Or do you still believe that demand/offer is only system, and war against differency is llegal?
Appendix I:
S1: Observing crimes would bring us start point of solving important social-sexual problems.
S2: Observing war conflicts would bring us the same.
S3: Presency of terorism cannot protect attacks, because terorism is only manifestation of insufucient impact of west culture to east and its eye hiding from it. In fact, islam is only telling us, that our culture isn't welcomed, until it evolves. They don't want to allow pornography, demoralisation and slavery to financial elitarism. That was me, europe, and you, usa, who judged judaism, and brang this conflict at the soil of africa. That was you, usa, who made slaves from black man, and now, you want to judge someone who has different religion.
Appendix II
I, man from europe, stay behind Iran, and I accuse you, from widening of hateress against islam, raised by popularisation of terrorism. Also you had widen partial lies about planting nuclear weaponery, terrorism, without any degree of proof. Also I accuse OSN of doing nothing at the west-east field, and from ignorancy at constituion freedom: how can international organisation support only one system? How can be peace built from false judging of different constitutions and its representatives? Who has right to pillorize Saddam Hussein before absolutely bestial court of resentiment. Is execution of saddam hussein our example of liberty widening? And also ask Irakians, if they like derogations made at their soil? I would like to know, If they feel as more healthy nation after that all. Would we Ignore, that whole Africa and Asia want to make union against inadecuate interferences from west part of globe, and will we allow next militar reforms from side of america? Is it right that America is using police against its professors and students, if they are critising militar regime?
Also I accuse all democratic systems of doing nothing in case of recentralisation to IT, for financial and powery reasons of few. I think www should be place of creating and repairing worlds infrastructure in sense of help. We are blind to allow someone to assert our people that internet cannow build peace and good living for anyone. Paper agencies are old enough to die, with misusing, lies, and low flexibility to problems.
Also I accuse anyone who is trying to tell me, that capitalism is a final solution, and I am doing it from point of inability to regulate itself. Also capitalism is supporting militarism, or minimally allowing presence of nuclear weaponary, which is 1)useless 2)totally unwanted from point of nature. Also It is doing nothing at field of mass Intellect level. There is no reason to continue if all is between I need and I have. Because if we all would be insane to kill ourselves and some institution would give it without medical advisory panel we would kill ourselves for no reason. There is more opportunities to get peace and prosperity throught internet than through parliament-media system, which leads to corruption. |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/29/2007 11:38:20 |
 |
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
 Posted - 10/29/2007 : 10:34:57 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by konikula
[Dave W 10/24/2007: 11:46:17, PG1]: I am not negating Darwin, if consciousness / will is frequentional. |
I apologize, but I am unable to parse any meaning from your post. For example, 'frequentional' is not an English word. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 10:53:56 [Permalink]
|
| I mean: there is more levels of consciousness in soul. There is collective consciousness also. And there is consciousness encrypted to reality through DNA, for which getting spined is act of will. (I saw a big enemy which kill my brothers. My friend, I have an idea: get spinned as your brother tree does! Oh yeah, I am feeling better, while I know I survive few more kilogenerations.) |
di:liny = mniamky |
|
|
|
Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:08:04 [Permalink]
|
| Spinned? Your brothers were killed by spinning? What does that mean? |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
|
|
|
|
konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
 Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:17:24 [Permalink]
|
sorry I thought that be spiny is equal to be spinned
unspiny hedgedog: I saw a big enemy which kill my brothers.
Christina: My friend, I have an idea: become spiny as your brother tree does!
after long long ages of learning how to get covered by spins
spiny hedgedog Oh yeah, I am feeling better, while I know I survive few more kilogenerations. thx Christina! |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/29/2007 11:20:38 |
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:24:43 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by konikula
I mean: there is more levels of consciousness in soul. There is collective consciousness also. And there is consciousness encrypted to reality through DNA, for which getting spined is act of will. (I saw a big enemy which kill my brothers. My friend, I have an idea: get spinned as your brother tree does! Oh yeah, I am feeling better, while I know I survive few more kilogenerations.) |
I've read the above several times. If I'm reading correctly, konikola is hypothesizing that a creature which sees others of its kind get slaughtered by a predator might get the idea of growing spines for protection (as some trees have), and somehow its consciousness imprints this idea on its germ-cell DNA through an act of will.
This absolutely runs counter to modern evolutionary biology. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:34:58 [Permalink]
|
Mm, as someone who taught herself english (and is pretty much doing the same with german - free online courses, yay), I'd suggest a basic textbook to pick up on the grammar (even if mine still sucks, it's readable, I hope) and start with something small; then eventually grow into more complex ideas.
Then again, I've been doing that for the last, what, 10 years? And I still make little sense... alas.
In any case, I'd guess Czech is farther away from English than Portuguese is, so maybe the whole thing is harder. |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
|
| Edited by - Siberia on 10/29/2007 11:36:22 |
|
|
|
astropin
SFN Regular
USA
970 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:36:36 [Permalink]
|
  |
I would rather face a cold reality than delude myself with comforting fantasies.
You are free to believe what you want to believe and I am free to ridicule you for it.
Atheism:
The result of an unbiased and rational search for the truth.
Infinitus est numerus stultorum |
|
|
|
pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:36:53 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by Siberia
Then again, I've been doing that for the last, what, 10 years? And I still make little sense... alas.
|
Hardly!  |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
|
|
|
|
konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:50:34 [Permalink]
|
Dave W: Yes, maybe we are diverging in style of that imprint, but you understanded right what I am saying. E.g.: that imprint can be through chemicals which are located at different measures on different places of the world (theory: so big changes can be stored by population migration, through chemical radicals leading to different degenerations). But rather I would divide evolution process to some assembly language, so every generation is one sentence, and whole biologic class is some piece of universal natural language, which is trying to use local condition at best.
Because to deal with totally random evolution is to deal with no nature (tree is base logic system which is easy visible - and we cannot imagine it is random, that every stick divides in some more sticks, it isn't randomness, it is rule, a will to sun :) |
di:liny = mniamky |
|
|
|
astropin
SFN Regular
USA
970 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:54:51 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by konikula
Dave W: Yes, maybe we are diverging in style of that imprint, but you understanded right what I am saying. E.g.: that imprint can be through chemicals which are located at different measures on different places of the world (theory: so big changes can be stored by population migration, through chemical radicals leading to different degenerations). But rather I would divide evolution process to some assembly language, so every generation is one sentence, and whole biologic class is some piece of universal natural language, which is trying to use local condition at best.
Because to deal with totally random evolution is to deal with no nature (tree is base logic system which is easy visible - and we cannot imagine it is random, that every stick divides in some more sticks, it isn't randomness, it is rule, a will to sun :)
|
It's like a whole new language! We need a rosetta stone here. |
I would rather face a cold reality than delude myself with comforting fantasies.
You are free to believe what you want to believe and I am free to ridicule you for it.
Atheism:
The result of an unbiased and rational search for the truth.
Infinitus est numerus stultorum |
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 11:57:46 [Permalink]
|
| Siberia, because you know when to use "then" and when to use "than," you're doing much, much better with the language than a lot of native English speakers. I bet you know the difference between "your" and "you're," also. On these Internet forums, nobody would ever know you're not American if you didn't tell them. Honest. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 12:05:33 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by konikula
Dave W: Yes, maybe we are diverging in style of that imprint, but you understanded right what I am saying. E.g.: that imprint can be through chemicals which are located at different measures on different places of the world (theory: so big changes can be stored by population migration, through chemical radicals leading to different degenerations). But rather I would divide evolution process to some assembly language, so every generation is one sentence, and whole biologic class is some piece of universal natural language, which is trying to use local condition at best.
Because to deal with totally random evolution is to deal with no nature (tree is base logic system which is easy visible - and we cannot imagine it is random, that every stick divides in some more sticks, it isn't randomness, it is rule, a will to sun :) |
Evolution isn't random, but mutations are. But "not random" does not mean "intentional act." A system which acts in a non-random way does not necessarily do so with purpose. A clock doesn't keep ticking because its gears and spring "will" themselves to keep proper time. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 12:41:07 [Permalink]
|
No, but there is will, acting as clock mechanism. So the prime will, which created clock, is translated, so still instancionally present within clock. If there was no will to create clock, there were no clock at all. So there is some will, which is needed for clock to show proper time. In one special view, clock, time is the highest form of manifestation of will. It divides imaginary ethernity to understandable areas, which are mathematically corresponding to actual location of will in universe, including worlds axe deflexion, distance from sun and also planting (agriculture) cycle, rhytm, when also agriculture is the biggest and most clear step forward of man (I know we understand technics, but also we do big mistakes, helping powers to kill the others, so technics, science wordly, isn't step forward, until we integrate it without damages to life, until it helps us to behave as one, which, you'll agree, is the best form of evolution [having nuclear weapons and dangerous politics is near to end as whole, also experimenting in Cern with no experiences in case, is very big danger, I would be glad if it was tested, but somewhere far in universe, because argumenting that these white wholes will be small is no argumenting, we can really damage everything...])
You can add: there is actually second will which is perpetually needed for clock to show time: will to put new batteries :) |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/29/2007 13:00:29 |
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26020 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 13:36:47 [Permalink]
|
Originally posted by konikula
No, but there is will, acting as clock mechanism. So the prime will, which created clock, is translated, so still instancionally present within clock. If there was no will to create clock, there were no clock at all. So there is some will, which is needed for clock to show proper time. In one special view... |
The parts that make a clock have no knowledge whatsoever of any "will" or even that they're a part of a clock. They are simply reacting, through physical laws, to their environment.
Similarly, the earliest single cells had no knowledge, experience or any hint of what was to become, for example, chlorophyll. They had no examples to go by - and no way to even "see" them had there been. The only way to suggest that they "willed" chlorophyll into existence is to claim that there's some sort of universal and eternal consciousness, but that brings up more questions than it answers.
And besides, it's still "negating" Darwin. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Global communication - beta
